The Marvel Thread

[Deaths Jester]

I think they ran all that bs to set up the fact that they are doing Avengers vs X-Men...becuase if you look at the ads for it you'll notice that Hope and Scarlet Witch are front and center in them.  Not sure though.  All I know is I'm getting tired of all the bs both DC and Marvel have pulled int he past two or three years..all their doing is destroying their once great universes.

[Tomato]

Having read and processed the last issue, I'm going to add a voice of (admittedly minor) descent here. Are the circumstances between Scarlet Witch being "innocent", Doom once again being evil incarnate, and Cyclops being a total tool here overdone? Of course they are. There are a lot of annoying issues with the series in general that should have been smoothed out over the several months of delays the blasted thing had.

That said though, I admit I'm oddly not upset about one thing in all this...

Spoiler

Surprisingly, I actually did like how the deaths of Cassie and Vision were handled. Unlike most of the deaths we see in comics, this didn't feel like death for the sake of dumb shock value. One of the things I always appreciated about the Young Avengers books is that despite how obvious something looks (Oh, sidekicks for Iron Man, Thor, Hulk, and Captain America. How original!) each of the characters had a unique history that tied neatly into the Avengers continuity in a way you wouldn't expect at first glace. There's very clearly been a rough plan in place as to who each of these characters were since the series started.

Iron Lad was a unique character because, at the end of the day, no matter how much he tried to change history and become a hero, he was always going to become Kang the Conqueror. As such, I feel like Cassie's death was always going to happen, to be that final catalyst to put him over the edge. And for him to have murdered the Vision, a representation of his continuing heroism... he can't come back from that now, not really.

Yes, it's depressing. It sucks because both characters were among the very few characters created this decade I actually liked. But at the same time, I don't really feel cheated by their deaths either.

[Previsionary]

Captain Marvel is back... or is she?

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=37616

[Epimethee]

The writing in the final issue of Young Avengers was not up to Heinberg's usual standard. It felt very artificial.

Spoiler

Kid Vision's death seemed very gratuitous to me, as my immediate reaction was that it was only done because Bendis had just brought the adult Vision back in the epithet-free Avengers book. I guess some editor thought it would be confusing. Mind you, there are still two Hawkeyes going around, but they're a bit easier to distinguish visually.

[Tomato]

Spoiler

I disagree. Yeah, the fact that original Vision's back says something about it maybe being a little forced, but again, my feeling is that Kid Vision's death served to underline Iron Lad's character arc. Vision was everything good and noble about Iron Lad, and by killing off that part of himself he forever sealed his fate of becoming Kang the conqueror. Besides, it's not like they didn't leave it open for him to come back, since they might as well have come out and yelled THIS IS HOW WE'RE GONNA DO IT HINT HINT with that whole "he's made backups but we don't have a decent body" segment.

Again, my feeling is at least with these deaths, there's a natural progression of the characters. Do I like that some of the few characters at marvel I still care about have died? Not really, no. But at least their deaths served the story, rather than being shoe-horned in for shock value. Besides... this is comics. They'll both be back alive somehow in a year, and I can think of at least one way they could revive Cassie just off the top of my head.

[Epimethee]

While the issue as a whole still didn't feel very well written, good point about the evolution of Iron Lad, Tomato.

[Previsionary]

There are some artists I wish Marvel would use less. This is one of them:

[thalaw2]

Someone was paid to do that?!??!  For a mainstream comicbook?

[murs47]

Romita Jr?

[Previsionary]

Romita Jr?

indeed it is. He has the art duties of issue 2 of the AvX event.

[murs47]

Yuk. At least he's better than his dad.

But there's so much talent out there! Like Weaver! Djurdekshdjfhdjghjghjghkvic! Immonen! C'mon Marvel! Step your game up!

[deano_ue]

  ok maybe its the headache but really not sure if you guys are serious about the romitas


so cho isn't drawing the entire series, thats just lost them the main selling point for me

[Podmark]

so cho isn't drawing the entire series, thats just lost them the main selling point for me

Cho is just drawing issue 0. The main series is by Romita Jr, Coipel, and Kubert.
I'll be getting it, not sure what to expect though.

As for Romita Jr, I used to love him on Spider-Man years ago, but he's dropped a few pegs for me since then.

[Tomato]

Guys, no offense, but this is an industry where Liefield and Land still get paid. Romita Jr may not be everyone's favorite, but at least I can look at his artwork without seeing "O" faces on every face or musculature that breaks the laws of physics.

[President Raygun]

There are some artists I wish Marvel would use less. This is one of them:

Are you sure this wasn't taken from an issue of "What The?!" - You broke my heart JRJr, you broke my heart.

[murs47]

Guys, no offense, but this is an industry...

I'm offended.

Seriously, Romita Jr. gets work because of the nostalgia factor. There are far better artists for "big" events like this.

[Tomato]

Maybe, but they're probably all busy trying to work on comics that actually matter.

[Epimethee]

I'm a bit shocked by some of the comments on Romita Jr. We're not exactly talking about some Liefield wannabe. His style may not be to everyone's taste and his recent Avengers work was IMO completely uninspired. However, he has at least to be credited for work ranging from very good (his early X-Men work) to truly great (Daredevil and Iron-Man).

[deano_ue]

so cho isn't drawing the entire series, thats just lost them the main selling point for me

Cho is just drawing issue 0. The main series is by Romita Jr, Coipel, and Kubert.
I'll be getting it, not sure what to expect though.

As for Romita Jr, I used to love him on Spider-Man years ago, but he's dropped a few pegs for me since then.

ok kubert, either is fine with me i'm back in

Guys, no offense, but this is an industry where Liefield and Land still get paid. Romita Jr may not be everyone's favorite, but at least I can look at his artwork without seeing "O" faces on every face or musculature that breaks the laws of physics.

land i will defend to a degree, he's a cover artist and thats it. he works well on pin ups and splash pages. sequential art should never be attempted

liefeld can go to the holy hell of people with too many pouches and shoulder pads for all i care

[Tomato]

No. Don't you dare defend Land. He outright steals work from everything he gets his little thief hands on, most of which is porn (thus why so many "O" faces in his comics). It's well documented.

[Deaths Jester]

You know, I think some of the problem with the above work by Romita Jr has to do with the colourist and inker (unless he's inking it himself then he's at fault for sure).  I'm not saying that the way he drew Wovie, Giant Man and the rest of the group is good...it isn't...but for me the colour work really sucks compared to some of the work I've seen in the past.  Really poor work al the way around!

[Previsionary]

so, Ironfist is now being tied into the phoenix force. That's JUST what that bird needed, more people tied into its convoluted history:

http://comicbook.com/blog/2012/03/29/new-avengers-25-a-marvel-avengers-vs-x-men-preview/

[Deaths Jester]

so, Ironfist is now being tied into the phoenix force. That's JUST what that bird needed, more people tied into its convoluted history:

http://comicbook.com/blog/2012/03/29/new-avengers-25-a-marvel-avengers-vs-x-men-preview/

Whu??!?!  Okay, that's the ultimate shark jumping moment in Marvel...I say it's time to jump ship on them!!

[murs47]

That's terrible.

[Tomato]

...

Since I'm pretty sure either prem told me or I told him about that nonsense like, over a month ago, I'm neither shocked nor disgusted at this point. Heck, this was one of the very first things I found out about the whole "Avengers Vs. X-men" farce, so my opinion of this event was pretty low right out of the gate.

Seriously, this garbage is why I don't read Marvel books with any consistency anymore. DC's new 52 garbage is no less annoying, but at least that provided an opening for some interesting books, whereas Marvel seems intent on destroying all their decent books with BACK TO BACK events that SHAKE ALL OF THE MARVEL UNIVERSE.

Ummm... Marvel? Yeah, I just want to read decent books like Secret Avengers without having event crap shoved in my face every other year. It's not going to make me read the event, especially when you consider that I have avoided EVERY SINGLE EVENT POST CIVIL WAR.

[Mystik]

i think ironfist is gonna be more of the "anti-phoenix" in the myths the dragon is the opposite or spouse of the phoenix

[deano_ue]

can someone explain to me why in avengers 24.1 everyone was fecking pink. i mean really bright pink skin tone

[laughing paradox]

Astonishing X-men #48 already has a roster that feels like an old school X-men team. It's great to see characters like Dr. Cecilia Reyes return, and it seems Karma is going to join as well (thanks to the cover), so I'm really looking forward to where this goes. I was pleased to see the villains in this issue, as well.. including its new member(s?). However, who the hell is Jean-Claude?! His name is Jean-Paul!

And why is Marvel hellbent on making Vision an irrational d-bag?

[Previsionary]

AvX #1 is finally out after being advertised in such an annoying way since November. Did anyone buy it, and if so, what are your thoughts?

[President Raygun]

AvX #1 is finally out after being advertised in such an annoying way since November. Did anyone buy it, and if so, what are your thoughts?

Felt too contrived (But what isn't these days)