The Marvel Thread

[murs47]

I think Joe Q stated somewhere a few months ago that fans were beginning to feel "event fatigue" and here the numbers show it. This explains the transition into the "Heroic Age" with less/no events. While the other Avengers titles have seen larger decreases in sales percentages, Mighty still has the lowest amount of individual units sold.

I wish I didn't see that chart. Secret Warriors numbers are dangerously low.

we're screwed either way, yes modern comics are event after event, and try to push the boundaries  to be relevant, but seriously the glory days weren't that glorious, i'm sorry but i'd rather not go back to the big hair,big guns, big muscles of the 90's the dark brooding gothic of the 80's or the gee old chum of the 60's and 70's

there is no way to please everyone

Word.

[tommyboy]

we're screwed either way, yes modern comics are event after event, and try to push the boundaries  to be relevant, but seriously the glory days weren't that glorious, i'm sorry but i'd rather not go back to the big hair,big guns, big muscles of the 90's the dark brooding gothic of the 80's or the gee old chum of the 60's and 70's

there is no way to please everyone

Beg to differ. On 70's comics, there was no "gee old chum" in the work of Gerber, Englehart, O'neil, McGregor or Starlin. Just well written comics.
The 80s and 90s had the likes of Alan Moore, Paul Chadwick, Will Eisner. Brilliant, life-affirming writers.
The glory days were pretty good..
But, there are some good and bad comics in every era, even this one.
And call me crazy, but if I sold a product with a circulation of less than 100,000 (more often 10-30,000), I'd actually listen to those customers who were unhappy and had stopped buying my product, rather than give them the finger. Because whatever problems old-school fanbuoys like me may bring, we were loyal, and spent the money year after year. All the "I was never interested in the Avengers till Bendis took over" types still aren't interested in the Avengers, and you know what? Now that the Avengers are Spider-woman and Wolverine who spend 6 months of the year lying on the ground going "Aaargh! My Powers!",and the rest of the time chatting over chinese food, I'm not interested either.


And Marhawkman, sorry, but I really do have to be so gleeful. Been hearing for 7 years how big sales = great writing. Well, it doesn't. And now they have neither big sales, nor great writing. Hah!

[daglob]

If I may put in a word about those '60s comics:

I know Stan Lee gets demonized today, but I bet that most of the fanboys would have been excited as all get out to have bought 1960s Marvel comics off the rack (provided they had been born early enough). Stan was the first writer I remember who didn't "write down" to his audience. Of course, the way Stan was working at the time, it wasn't just Stan, but it was Stan and Jack, and Stan and Steve, and Stan and Don, and so on. A lot of what Stan and (fill in the blank), or Gardner Fox, or Ed Hamilton, or Alfred Bester, or John Broome, or  Joe Gill, or any other of Stan's contemporaries wrote was fluff or garbage, but there were some gems... not all of it was a bunch of empty headed maniquins paling around and fighting harmless criminals with a "Gee Old Chum".

The same can be said of  the '50s and the '40s, and probably the '30s.

[Previsionary]

I think everyone knew Spider-woman would be canceled because of A) how slow and behind it is in congruence with current Marvel, B) anyone can watch the whole thing for free, and C) the artist is working on something else as is Bendis. Nothing to be excited over.

But seriously, we know you dislike Bendis, we know I dislike Fraction's X-men, we know AA dislikes how Ares died; and we know Murs is upset with Deadpool's current treatment (and something about Pod here)... do you really have to go on about it all the time? It goes from being amusing to being annoying. Let's return to the "rant once a month" schedule, please. I honestly can't figure out why you follow Bendis related news so vehemently when you know you'll only be upset. Suffice it to say, this isn't a Bendis thread, but most of the time he's brought up, it's ironically by you. If you'd quit talking about him, then no one would comment on him. I think the thing that bothers me the most is that every time the thread gets back on track, typically by my own efforts, someone pops in and knocks it astray all over again with a comment that contributes nothing to the thread and offers nothing to discuss. If people at least did that, it wouldn't bother me nearly as much. Even worse is that I just made a comment a few weeks ago asking people to consider what they're posting when it came to their negativity.

Haha! As much fun as it is to see you guys reaffirm your positions with current comics (again), this is a Marvel review/discussion thread, not a "abandon all hope ye who enter!" thread. I already expend enough energy in trying to keep the thread afloat; I don't need irrelevant negativity making it that much harder. Consider that for next time, please.

I would really appreciate it if people could heed the message, and if they really feel compelled to rant with no reason, make a thread about it instead.

[Previsionary]

Daglob, Stan isn't really "demonized" today. It's just very apparent his writing style doesn't hold up well at all without it seeming very cheesy. He's a writer of his time, and there's no mistaking that his team-ups in his day made his work better and much more enjoyable than it has been in the past few years.


X23 #1

Spoiler

I showed excitement over this book when I saw the previews, but did it hold up? Well, let's start off with the art. It's very stylized, and though I believe it worked in some of the scenes with the Gamemaster, other times I really disliked it. Since the book has two artists, I can't pinpoint whose style I semi-liked and whose I semi-disliked, so I'll just say the art was OK overall (it works best in the dream sequences). As for the story, Jubilee and Wolverine aren't as integral to the story as the previews would have you believe. The book, which is around 40 pages in length for 4 dollars (I approve), mostly focuses on X-23 and her feelings of not being "real" or complete. Interposed with this are remnants of her past being re-exposed to the reader and also some of her old friends from the NYX mini return. I guess the problem with this book is that there didn't really feel like their was a focused plot point outside of X23's return to cutting and her wanting to feel like a real person. Majorie Liu just seemed to be stuck in making us remember some of the past plots with X23 instead of actually moving this issue forward, and the scenes with Gamemaster seemed so forced to me. Being cryptic for cryptic's sake isn't going to do it for me. I need a purpose, Majorie. A real purpose for you bringing that villain into play. With that said, this was an issue heavy on emotion, so she wins on that front.

Regardless, I think it's a fairly good read if you're a fan of the character or are interested in learning about her without having to go through her history, otherwise pass. 2 (2.5?) out of 5. It really disappoints me that this was a One-shot instead of a mini considering the plot points introduced and then dropped. Of course, this could easily be followed up on, which may change my opinions. On the plus side, Laura had inner dialogue and some stuff happened in the book that should affect her growth a bit. As things stand, however, there's no where to put in said development. Ugh.

So, what do you all think, or what have you read this week?

[tommyboy]

I think everyone knew Spider-woman would be canceled because of A) how slow and behind it is in congruence with current Marvel, B) anyone can watch the whole thing for free, and C) the artist is working on something else as is Bendis. Nothing to be excited over.

But seriously, we know you dislike Bendis, we know I dislike Fraction's X-men, we know AA dislikes how Ares died; and we know Murs is upset with Deadpool's current treatment (and something about Pod here)... do you really have to go on about it all the time? It goes from being amusing to being annoying. Let's return to the "rant once a month" schedule, please. I honestly can't figure out why you follow Bendis related news so vehemently when you know you'll only be upset. Suffice it to say, this isn't a Bendis thread, but most of the time he's brought up, it's ironically by you. If you'd quit talking about him, then no one would comment on him. I think the thing that bothers me the most is that every time the thread gets back on track, typically by my own efforts, someone pops in and knocks it astray all over again with a comment that contributes nothing to the thread and offers nothing to discuss. If people at least did that, it wouldn't bother me nearly as much. Even worse is that I just made a comment a few weeks ago asking people to consider what they're posting when it came to their negativity.

Haha! As much fun as it is to see you guys reaffirm your positions with current comics (again), this is a Marvel review/discussion thread, not a "abandon all hope ye who enter!" thread. I already expend enough energy in trying to keep the thread afloat; I don't need irrelevant negativity making it that much harder. Consider that for next time, please.

I would really appreciate it if people could heed the message, and if they really feel compelled to rant with no reason, make a thread about it instead.

umm... yeah, see... my confusion was with the whole "The Marvel Thread" title and all, so I thought that news regarding the sales figures for, and cancellation of, Marvel comic books would be appropriate in this thread rather than that I start another. My bad.
Don't worry, this will be my last post in this thread.

[murs47]

I think Prev was referring to your continuous anti-Bendis "rants." Posting sales numbers is appropriate for this thread, at least in my eyes.

[Previsionary]

Hercules: Fall of an Avenger #1:

Spoiler

A day after the Prince of Power has died (again), Amadeus finds himself at The Parthenon in Athens to pay his respect to Hercules and to call out Athena for actions Amadeus suspects her of doing. Obviously, she doesn?t appear in the temple, but someone else does. Actually, more than someone, several heroes that were associated with Herc appear to pay their honor from Snowbird and Wolverine to Banner and his son. Thor gives a toast, reminds everyone of some of Herc?s greatest feats, and finishes his speech off with a tale from his childhood involving Hercules that takes place shortly after their first meeting. The story ends on a fairly humorous not, heh heh.

The anecdotes continues as Namor, Snowbird, Black widow, the Dark Elf,  Namora, and Banner tell stories about why they loved Herc. Northstar was also there, but he had to go. Let?s just say his brief scene acknowledged a part of Herc?s history that isn?t spoken of these days. The book ends with Amadeus finally coming to terms with the loss of his best friend just seconds before Athena, Pluto, and several other gods appear in her temple and order the heroes out; She needs to speak to the new leader of the Olympus group?Amadeus Cho!

I loved this issue. It may have been a tribute to Herc, but Pak managed to work in some humor and still work in a lot of Herc?s most memorable moments. That scene where the Dark Elf from the Thorcules arc explained a *ahem* technique Hercules performed on her for 28 minutes and the looks on Namor, Wolverine, Snowbird, and Thor?s face was priceless. There?s no real plot to be found here, and there?s really no need for one until after Amadeus is pushed into his new status. The backup is another Atlas tale (written by Paul Tobin) that finds Athena and Namora tying up some loose ends revolving around Herc such as liquidating some of his forgotten holdings and telling the people he helped that he had passed (again). Overall, tis a 4 for me. Very enjoyable read. If the art was slightly better in the main part, I?d give it a? 4.5.

[Podmark]

But seriously, we know you dislike Bendis, we know I dislike Fraction's X-men, we know AA dislikes how Ares died; and we know Murs is upset with Deadpool's current treatment (and something about Pod here)...

Yeah I don't really get angry much. I'm pretty easy going. The New X-Men cancellation and the Batgirl mess both got to me though.

The stated reason for Spider-Woman's cancellation was the amount of work involved in making a motion comic on Maleev. Which I can believe as most modern artist can only produce about 8-10 issues a year normally, so adding the rest of the work would keep the schedule behind. Still I'm sure sales figures played a role in it's end.

To my disappointment Avengers Academy has been said to not be a direct followup to Avengers: The Initiative as I'd hoped. It's supposed to be thematically similiar and carry over some characters, and I'll definitely try it out but the characters revealed so far haven't really grabbed me. Reptil seemed kinda cool in his one shot and Hazmat caught my eye but that's it at the moment. Still I liked Gage's work and I like McKone so I'm hoping for the best.

And to help keep this boat afloat I will post some short reviews:

Legacy:

Spoiler

Rogue borrows the Cuckoos powers so they can try searching for the Phoenix (they fail) and goes about her day. She learns about Gambit's Death problem, has a steamy encounter with Magnus, and helps some of the students. She also picks up the thoughts of someone who's madly in love with her but doesn't find the source, though she does eliminate Bobby (Pod thinks it's Bling). She tells Gambit that she can't be with him now because she needs to maintain control to keep her powers in check, and he symbolizes lack of control in her.

It's the usual solid Carey issue. Art was alright, and I liked the use of the students particularly Rockslide. Carey writes a really good Magneto.

I give it a 4/5 on my meter.

Spider-Man:

Spoiler

Norah and Peter watch as the new Rhino attacks the old Rhino and kills his wife in the process. This causes Alexsei, who'd been trying to live his life straight, to return to his costume and leave the man behind and become the animal. The two Rhino face off in a duel to the death. Despite Spider-Man's attempts to stop Alexsei brutally kills the new Rhino, blaming Spider-Man for what happened.

Really enjoyed this issue, and the first one that came before it a month or so back. It wasn't the outcome I wanted, but it was great regardless. I haven't read all of his appearances but I'd think this would be up at the top of best Rhino stories ever. Really enjoyed Max Fiumara art, him and Joe Kelly might be my favorite Spidey team right now (though Bachelo is coming up again...).

I really enjoyed this I'll give it a 5/5 on my scale.

Siege 3:

Spoiler

The US government turns against Norman, and the Avengers show up and join the fight. Thor takes on the Sentry who is turning into some kind of horrible monster. Norman orders Sentry to destroy Asgard - which he does and it crashes onto the city below. Tony awakes and dawns an old armor and hacks the Iron Patriot armor allowing Spidey to punch out Osborn (who oddly is green skinned for no stated reason). Norman claims he was the only one protecting them from the Sentry who has now become some demonic creature - I assume this is the Void? I don't really know much about the Sentry. Someone want to fill me in maybe?

I didn't understand a couple things, but overall I enjoyed it. The Sentry makes a pretty good threat, and Copiel depiction of him was a highlight. Copiel is the real star here, his art has really improved since I first saw him in back in Red Zone. He's smoothed things out and looks kinda like a cross of Bachelo and Cheung - two of my favorites.

I dub thee a 4/5 with the art being the biggest factor.

Wow haven't done that much reviewing in a long time. Hope your happy Prev.

[Silver Shocker]

The thing I enjoyed so much about the Rhino story is:

Spoiler

1. When I think about it, it's not just the best Rhino story I've ever read, it's possibly the only good one. With the arguable exception of Peter Milligan's Flowers for Rhino story in Tangled Web (which admittedly I didn't enjoy all that much, though I do consider it a strong effort), and the original two-issue story by Stan Lee and Jr Sr. Now admittedly my knowledge of his major appearances is pretty spotty, but I do know from reading the Marvel Essential line that unless he appeared in Spidey stories in Marvel Team Up or something, he didn't reappear in Spider-Man's books for over TWENTY years.  I hear he fought the Hulk though so he probably made appearances in other books, which was a pretty common occurrence back then. Somewhere down the line, I wanna say 90's to early new millennium, the Rhino became the dumb guy Spidey tricked into crashing into a wall at the beginning of stories that weren't about the Rhino.

2. The thing about Flowers for Rhino, is that the entire story hinged on the fact that Rhino was of low intelligence. The story is about how different his life becomes once he temporarily becomes gifted with above average intelligence, and the story ends on a downer note with these developments undone, with the moral being that the guy can't escape the lot life's thrown at him.   What I loved about Kelly's Rhino issues was that although it kinda contradicts every marvel story that ever portrayed Rhino as a dumb, uninteresting villain, it told what is almost a mirror opposite story to Flowers for Rhino - one where Rhino doesn't need exposure to any scientific or magical enhancements to make a better life for himself; and even though this story also ends on a downer note for Rhino, it IMO is still an incredible uplifting take on a character who prior to this story had very little potential, to the point that the Spidey cartoons and video games were presenting him as the dumb loser from almost the get-go. It's proof that all it takes a writer with a good idea to make a character interesting (like what DC did with Catman), and it is another story by Kelly during this run of Spidey that given me a respect for him as a writer I didn't even have when he wrote Deadpool, a book that many consider him to be the definitive writer on.

As for Siege: I really enjoyed it. The pace is decent for a Bendis book, and at the risk of mirroring Podmark's comments, Coipel's strong art boosts the book up a few levels. If the thing was drawn by Lenil Francis Yu for example (an artist I personally don't care for), I probably couldn't get into it at all.

One thing I found interesting about Norman is:

Spoiler

When you see his face without the armor, not only is his face green, but he has what looks like a set of teeth over his lips. My gut reaction is "makeup?", leading me to wonder if Bendis is trying to stretch the Osborne = Joker analogy further then he has before (in his original Illuminati one-shot, just before Civil War, he had Maria Hill say a speech about whether or not Spidey was responsible for "all those people the Green Goblin kills", an analogy that sounded more fitting to Batman/Joker than Spidey/GG). However, the fact that his face is treated as a big reveal (appearing at the turn of a page and taking up a large amount of it) makes me really unsure, leading me to guess that Osborne put on some kind of makeup or mask and the scene is supposed to show that the long awaited "Osborne's losing his cool" moment has arrived.

As for the Sentry:

Spoiler

I found myself having to look at someone else's summary online to get a idea of what was really going on, but apparently what we were supposed to take from the issue was that Osborne's much hyped "secret weapon" was the Void, leaving me a bit disappointed and kinda scratching my head at whether this makes sense in light of what we've been shown before or not.

[Previsionary]

Wow haven't done that much reviewing in a long time. Hope your happy Prev.

No, I'm not. Do more. . No, I appreciate it, sir. ^^

I read Siege #3 and while it may have been MUCH better than issue #1 and slightly better than #2, it had quite a number of scenes that just didn't make sense for me as were mentioned by you guys already. I also thought the Sentry/Thor was fairly one-sided until Sentry snapped.

I'm also going to conclude, once and for all, that Brian Reed's Ms. Marvel work is out of continuity. I guess I wasn't the only one that saw little value in his work. *snark*

[Bloodshadow]

Siege is kinda cool to me in the way that it looks like by the end of it Loki will once again be responsible for the formation of the "real" Avengers
Poor guy,for being such a master trickster,seems to me he helps Thor more than hurt him.

[BlueBard]

Siege is kinda cool to me in the way that it looks like by the end of it Loki will once again be responsible for the formation of the "real" Avengers
Poor guy,for being such a master trickster,seems to me he helps Thor more than hurt him.

Haven't read Siege... might do a TPB when/if... but I'd like to comment on Loki for a moment.

Depending on how you view the character and who's writing him, Loki's agenda has always been to upset the Status Quo for his own reasons and his feelings toward his half-brother are more complex than mere hatred.

Loki gains when Osborne overthrows the established order; he enjoys the chaos.  But allowing Osborne to keep the upper hand would not be a gain for Loki in any way, shape, or form.  I'm sure Loki had an evil smirk on his face every time Osborne had a setback.

Also, in many ways Loki is like the younger brother who loves to play tricks on his older sibling.  To tweak his nose, break his toys, and see what he can get away with.  If Thor is on the ropes (and Loki's not the one who put him there) he can't really gloat over it the way he'd like to.  If Thor is in a position of strength and authority on the other hand, Loki can't do much to hurt him.

If you really want to follow the actual mythology to its' conclusion, Loki is ultimately responsible for the destruction of the entire world as we know it, along with the destruction of Asgard and the death of Thor.  Anything less is just Loki playing for his own amusement.

[deano_ue]

siege kicked arse. i  really think the shorter issue run it helping it a lot

i did think though that it would be an interesting idea if

Spoiler

carnage was what caused sentry to finally go loopy, sentry ripped the Symbiote apart and it infects him but does it slowly. it's ainteresting left field twist so we know it's not gonna happen

[Silver Shocker]

Nah I don't see that being too likely, especially since Bendis said in an interview that "Carnage is crap". Since he made Ultimate Carnage in USM, I'm guessing it's the 616 version of the character he doesn't like. It also doesn't help that his portrayal of Carnage in New Avengers didn't match up with what we've seen before of the villain (i.e. there didn't seem to be a human bonded with the Symbiote when Sentry did what he did to him.)  I think it would also probably render the Sentry developments in Dark Avengers or what have you pointless.  Now, on the other hand, if he did end up doing that, I'd be kinda impressed.

[AfghanAnt]

Siege #3

Spoiler

I enjoyed the art and the writing was solid. Osborne painting his face like GG wasn't nearly as much as a shock as it should've been. I think Dark X-Men really showed that Osborne's Goblin was very much active and very much ready to be raise to the surface again. If you read Dark Avengers 13-15 you'd know that the Void was revealed to be Osborne's ace. Dark Avengers also reveals that Sentry/Void's powers are based on some force that was wielded in Biblical times. I thought Sentry's statement of how "How many more Gods' do I have to kill" is telling to his existence. He's is a God-slayer - he slayed Ares and then destroyed Asgard. I know people hate Bendis but I've been reading the undertones of this story and I love it - it's new vs old, the God vs the gods. I've actually really enjoyed the developments of Sentry as a character but I ultimately think he never had a place in this world and this was his perfect exit. Not only because he's based on a powerset that just doesn't fit in Marvel (see Superman) but because it's the hero(es)'s journey and we'll see a return to the old mythology of the Marvel Universe. I'm excited for Bendis' Heroic Age titles. He made me buy comics again. I am excited to see what he's going to do with Luke Cage, Spider-man, and Wolverine. I'm equally excited to see his take on the classic Avengers (even if I hate the art).

I'm sure this thread will implode but whatever. I've always felt like comics were growing with me (I'm 27 now). I remember reading old Superboy/Superman comics when I was a 9 and I loved them because they were so fantastic, fun, and easy but as I grew I really started seeing comics are about change and telling a story. There are a lot of alternatives out there. I've particularly grown fond of Bendis' Ult Spider-man (this title is so much fun) and Marvel Adventure Avengers (was this cancelled?). Yeah it's a lot less serious but there is a lot less action and it is definitely more relatable for 60's and 70''s comic fans than more serious mainstream comics.

And as for Bendis' talking heads, I love it. If you don't, don't buy it. It really is that simple. I hate most of Geoff Johns' work but I'm not in the DC thread screaming about it. I do like Blackest Night but it's entirely novelty if you ask me. He's great at rehashing (this whole idea is Alan Moores) but he never knows how to end it. Look at JSA, Teen Titans, Superman, and Adventure Comics - these are all titles that relaunched sold a lot and just fizzled in a year or less but I never see I hate Johns' comment.

[GhostMachine]

Personally, I'm waiting for the TPB, depending on how things turn out, but I am hoping Siege ends with

Spoiler

Sentry either dead or depowered (as in no powers at all, not as in a lot less powerful) and Osborn outed and exposed so thoroughly he can never gain the kind of power he's had again. Norman Osborn needs to either be the Green Goblin, dead or both. (I've always thought that bringing him back was a huge mistake in the first place.)

[lugaru]

I agree with AA and GM. Yeah, I hope people make comics for kids but I'm not angry that most comics are geared to somebody my age. Sucks for the industry, great for me, hahaha. I'm loving siege and I hope it ends with Norman as something other than the goblin. Give him armor, a disfigurement, make him something else. Make one of the 50 or so other people who have been a green (or hob, or demo) goblin the current one. Seriosly I think Norman can be the next Doctor Doom if treated right.

[BlueBard]

There is only one Victor Von Doom; Nobody, not even Norman Osborne, has close to Doom's ego, Doom's ambition, and Doom's potential.  Doom's intellect is rivaled only by the likes of Reed Richards and the other great intellects of the MU.  His technology and resources are as great or greater than Tony Stark's at the height of his career.  And if technology should fail him?  He turns to sorcery.  He's no Dormammu, but his knowledge of magic is not to be scoffed at.

There is very little that Doctor Doom would not dare to do, given the opportunity.  Look at how he managed to steal the Beyonder's power in Secret Wars as one example.

Furthermore, Doom is not mentally unbalanced.  There's no psychotic personality lurking in the back of his psyche threatening to ruin his self-control and risk his schemes. 

Doom's only real weakness is his ego, his conviction that no one else's genius could possibly be greater than his own or that no inferior intellect could possibly ruin his plans.

If Marvel would write Doom the way he should be written, Norman Osborne would look ridiculous in comparison and the Void would be just one more entity for Doom to outsmart and exploit.

[AfghanAnt]

There is only one Victor Von Doom; Nobody, not even Norman Osborne, has close to Doom's ego, Doom's ambition, and Doom's potential.  Doom's intellect is rivaled only by the likes of Reed Richards and the other great intellects of the MU.  His technology and resources are as great or greater than Tony Stark's at the height of his career.  And if technology should fail him?  He turns to sorcery.  He's no Dormammu, but his knowledge of magic is not to be scoffed at.

There is very little that Doctor Doom would not dare to do, given the opportunity.  Look at how he managed to steal the Beyonder's power in Secret Wars as one example.

Furthermore, Doom is not mentally unbalanced.  There's no psychotic personality lurking in the back of his psyche threatening to ruin his self-control and risk his schemes. 

Doom's only real weakness is his ego, his conviction that no one else's genius could possibly be greater than his own or that no inferior intellect could possibly ruin his plans.

If Marvel would write Doom the way he should be written, Norman Osborne would look ridiculous in comparison and the Void would be just one more entity for Doom to outsmart and exploit.

Totally out of left field with this one.

[herodad1]

i dont buy comics much anymore( just Thor ) so i come here for the low down on whats going on.couple questions...1.)how did herc die? 2.) how did ares die? 3.)did sentry and thor throw down?if so how did that battle play out?  thanks!

[lugaru]

There is only one Victor Von Doom; Nobody, not even Norman Osborne, has close to Doom's ego, Doom's ambition, and Doom's potential.  Doom's intellect is rivaled only by the likes of Reed Richards and the other great intellects of the MU.  His technology and resources are as great or greater than Tony Stark's at the height of his career.  And if technology should fail him?  He turns to sorcery.  He's no Dormammu, but his knowledge of magic is not to be scoffed at.

There is very little that Doctor Doom would not dare to do, given the opportunity.  Look at how he managed to steal the Beyonder's power in Secret Wars as one example.

Furthermore, Doom is not mentally unbalanced.  There's no psychotic personality lurking in the back of his psyche threatening to ruin his self-control and risk his schemes. 

Doom's only real weakness is his ego, his conviction that no one else's genius could possibly be greater than his own or that no inferior intellect could possibly ruin his plans.

If Marvel would write Doom the way he should be written, Norman Osborne would look ridiculous in comparison and the Void would be just one more entity for Doom to outsmart and exploit.

Totally out of left field with this one.

He was responding to my suggestion that Normie could aspire to a DR. DOOM style position, but it is ok if you skip my posts. Yeah, doom is certainly a more powerful character. He is also smarter, and more versatile, and probably more handsome by the time the heroes are done beating up norman for this. But I would love Norman to be a nation or world level threat at the end of this, a clever scheemer and not a guy on a glider throwing pumpkins at people.

[Previsionary]

As far as Doom goes, if Millar's run is taken into consideration (and I suppose it should after PAD made use of it *sigh*), then Doom has reached a point where he's over his rivalry with Reed Richards and his magic prowess has grown beyond 10 fold... he was also eaten, so there's that. At this very moment, Doom is seen as a big threat by several players in the Marvel universe because he's involved in 2 events (DOOMwar and Fall of Hulks), and he's doing something in X-factor I can't bring myself to care about.

Herodad, I reviewed the issue of Herc where he died, and AA (and others) reviewed the Ares death. We also were just talking about Thor/Sentry above... but:

Spoiler

1. Herc died after finding himself bloody and bruised in an alternate universe that collapsed on itself after Athena destroyed the machinery creating the portal.

2. Ares was ripped in half, vertically, by Sentry in Siege #2

3. I... don't have the energy to do a play by play of thor/sentry. Sorry.

[Podmark]

I wouldn't be against Osborn being something other than the Goblin. I enjoyed him as the Iron Patriot.

[lugaru]

I wouldn't be against Osborn being something other than the Goblin. I enjoyed him as the Iron Patriot.

Same here... nobody wanted him back but I think they found a good niche for him.

And I've got a sentry theory:

Spoiler

I think the sentry does not exist... it is 100% void. In other words the void is not a side effect of the sentry, but instead the sentry is the void granting selfish wishes to a weak person to totally get it's claws in him. I'm probably wrong but I do like this idea.

[Previsionary]

New book day!

Unfortunately, I doubt I'll be doing any today. However, Paul Cornell did an X-position a few days ago and this caught my eye:

3) Do you have any idea where can we find out what will happen to Nate Grey (maybe "Second Coming")? Were you told what would happen to him after your book? Or were you just given the directive to have him locked up by the end?

I think Nick wanted to have him locked up; maybe that was in the brief, yes. Or at least, we decided on it towards the end of the process. I don't know what happens to him next. If there's an audience for a solo book, I'd love to write it.

Now, to be honest, I'm not a big fan of X-man (and I only began to like him recently), but if he ends up being the gateway into getting Paul on an ongoing... I'd take it. Heck, I still think the Dark X-men should be operating during the Heroic Age, post "Second Coming." It'd be a good way to develop those characters past the niches they found themselves in. I'd like to think of it as the X-men version of Thunderbolts.

4) I have a weird question about a small detail here, but why was Nate's eye bandaged up at the end of the book? Maybe I don't know enough about the character, but does he derive some of his powers out of his ability to see from that eye?

That's his glowing eye, and following the torture...it may or may not be there anymore. Draw your own conclusions.

This, though, makes me think of Cable.

[Previsionary]

Double Post!

Can anyone explain to me why Marvel chooses to put event banners on every book they possibly can even if the book in question doesn't tie into the storyline at all? *looks at Mighty Avengers #35* What this book had in common with Siege was wrapped up 3 months ago. Please don't do that Marvel, and please don't use this book to bring back the real Wasp. There's just too much ridiculousness going on -- Ultron and his army of ten billion [Jocasta] brides! On the other hand, I suppose Dan Slott did good in tying everything into recent continuity. If only that had been a priority EARLIER.

[Zippo]

I've sort of started to enjoy Mighty Avengers now because of the ridiculousness. At the very least it's surprising.

I hope Nate doesn't get screwed over... Taking out his eye shouldn't be a bother to someone who willed their own body into existence.

[Previsionary]

So, I broke my boycott on Uncanny for one issue to see how Kitty was going to return. It's funny how a book billed as "The Return of Kitty" is more about Cyclops and Magneto than it is about how Katherine is important to the X-men. This book was a giant cameo city as EVERYONE took a backseat to Cyclops and Magneto (this includes Kitty). Even Emma could only talk about Scott for several pages to a barely conscious Magneto. Look, I've come to the conclusion that Fraction consciously ignored all those safeguards Whedon put on that bullet to keep that poor girl in space, but the lead up to and actual collection of Kitty made no sense. And you know, Fraction also included a few pages of the Fantastic Four scolding the X-men for some decisions they made. Their cameo would have been much better served in the Kitty plot, me thinks, considering the circumstances Kitty finds herself in has already been solved by Reed before. Obviously, that was something I expected, so it didn't happen. The last 3 pages of the book, the aftermath, were wholly out of line with what I thought the book was supposed to be about. Everyone seemed to be in such a light, nonchalant mood despite what Kitty was going through. All I'm saying is I expected more emotion and this book to revolve around Kitty and her friends, not a mishmash of cameos in a story that somehow became about Cyclops. I get it... you like Cyclops, but there are 1,000 other characters in this book. Use them!

On the positive, the art was a minor step up (and the back up was even better as it was drawn by Phil Jimenez). Unfortunately, the backup story is sort of worthless even though the themes it plays with are pertinent to Kitty's time in space. (It also rose the price of the book by a dollar). If it had come earlier in a different book (I.E., when SWORD discovered Kitty was still phasing the bullet or just after Whedon wrote her out), it would have been better.

[Talavar]

Uncanny X-men 522 is problematic for the new power level this bumps Magneto to.  I mean, he manipulated an already-massive object moving at nearly the speed of light from interstellar distances.  Sure, he had to try really hard, but that's kind of ridiculous.