Earth's Mightiest Heroes - Season 2

[Previsionary]

They're completely lying about how popular "Ultimate Spider-man" is. That show is not being lauded, and I'd appreciate if Quesada/Loeb didn't continue to treat the viewing audience like idiots when they know they have workers erasing negative commentary on their feedback pages.

[Tomato]

I have a new response to every bit of news about or concerning Loeb (linked because it technically contains a curse word)

http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/1199/loeb.png

I feel the maturity (or lack thereof) of this image is appropriate to the level of maturity Loeb shows us on a daily basis.

[Talavar]

I love how, after Loeb says the new Avengers cartoon will be more like the movie, the interviewer asks if that means it will be more adult-oriented, and Loeb's immediate response is no.  Jeph Loeb: 'It's going to be just like the film, except in any meaningful way!'

[BentonGrey]

I love how, after Loeb says the new Avengers cartoon will be more like the movie, the interviewer asks if that means it will be more adult-oriented, and Loeb's immediate response is no.  Jeph Loeb: 'It's going to be just like the film, except in any meaningful way!'

Ha!  That's good.

Prev., really?  They've got folks erasing negative comments?  How sad is that?

[Tomato]

That's standard business practice at Marvel nowadays. IIRC, they did the same thing when they started getting backlash after publicly supporting HIPPA/SOPA.

[Previsionary]

I love how, after Loeb says the new Avengers cartoon will be more like the movie, the interviewer asks if that means it will be more adult-oriented, and Loeb's immediate response is no.  Jeph Loeb: 'It's going to be just like the film, except in any meaningful way!'

Ha!  That's good.

Prev., really?  They've got folks erasing negative comments?  How sad is that?

Yes.

Marveltvnews.com reports that Marvel might be censoring the criticism the Ultimate Spider-Man cartoon has been getting lately. From the article:

"To make things worse, starting 2 days ago, Marvel and Man of action have been deleting most negative comments about the show. In fact i was surprised to find almost more than 70% of the comments that criticized the show have been removed, even though they contained no profanity. The other suspicious part are that new “positive” comments towards the show have been posted just today to stay at the top of the comments."

Whether this is true or not remains to be seen. You can read the rest of the article on the source.  Source: Marvel TV News

That spread all over the interwebs. People were not happy, as you can imagine. Loeb went as far as to delete one of his fan pages. People were also mad that Josh Keaton (the guy that voiced Peter in Spectacular) was replaced (redubbed) in EMH by Drake Bell. Ultimate Spider-man attracted so much bad press that I was surprised nothing was ever posted here. Then again, no one seems to watch the show here either, so... yeah.

[Glitch Girl]

Glad I'm not the only one unhappy with the voicing on USM (among other things, a LOT of other things). 

Deleting bad press?  Guys guys guys  ...  you should know by now that's exactly how NOT to handle the internets.

I can't help but think this whole mess could have been avoided so easily by adding Black Widow as a regular to the EMH cast and tweaking the costumes to fit the movie mode a bit.  I mean, Cap's gotten a tweak this season (even though he's... you know, Skrully and all) so it's not unprecedented.

I admit, I was not a huge fan of the general production design of EMH, but the writing, animation, and voice acting sold me on it.  Even though this second season has been weaker than the first (primarily because it feels far less focused), there's still a lot to like.  I will really hate to see it go.

[Tomato]

Yes, but that still doesn't solve the fundamental problem of "Loeb didn't create it, so it has to go"

[Glitch Girl]

True.

Still, I'd prefer the shorter version:

Loeb didn't create it, so it has to go

[Shogunn2517]

Well... I guess disgruntled animation fans can at least look forward to...

HULK and the Agents of S.M.A.S.H. !   

OMFNG I THOUGHT YOU WERE JOKING!!!

[crimsonquill]

Agent X (an insider of Marvel) has apparently spilled the beans for Marvel Animation Studios plans for 2012...

http://www.marveltvnews.com/2012/06/13/exclusive-agent-x-spills-the-bean-on-the-future-of-marvel-animation-and-did-he-just-mention-a-new-x-men-tv-series/

First of all he states that Marvel Studios is VERY aware they messed up with Ultimate Spider-Man by focusing it on kids instead of a family audience and has been doing everything they can to minimize bad feedback because the network already had ordered 2 seasons of the show. Fans have been tearing apart the show on Marvel message boards and protesting against watching it that Agent X confirms that under orders the moderators are deleting ALL bad feedback to keep from scaring off new viewers.

"Marvel was so shocked and in awe at the huge number of complaints the company received for Ultimate Spider-man. The company started censoring their social pages (twitter, facebook) to block users from hating on the show, and therefore spreading the hate online."

Marvel already knows they messed up with HULK Agents Of SMASH as well because they ALSO focused that show on kids and used the same levels of humor and juvenile storylines with lots of action and barely any story at all. So if you AEMH fans were hoping that it was a spin-off show to bring more Hulk adventures with a larger cast but with the same respect for the characters you WILL be disappointed.

"According to Agent X, Avengers Assemble is the most ambitious TV animation project for marvel, ever. Unlike, Ultimate Spider-man and Hulk Agents of SMASH, the new Avengers show is taking cues from the successful Marvel Cinematic Universe, and from the thousands of angry fans comments towards the direction of Ultimate Spider-man. As a result the new show WILL NOT be in the same universe as Ultimate Spidey, nor is it in the same universe as Hulk and the Agents of SMASH."

That news alone makes me take a deeeeeeeep sigh of relief that maybe Marvel Animation learned their lesson and is going to try to capture some of the big screen Avengers awesomeness on the small screen too. It makes sense after all. If they only plan to make Avengers movies as a trilogy then it would be a nice way to have more development with an alternate version of the movieverse.

And Agent X teases that additional 2 animated series are in the works.. one is already spoiled and revealed in the link.

- CQ

[Talavar]

I hope at least some of that is true Crimsonquill (mainly the stuff about Avengers Assemble), but Loeb has also gone on record as saying Avengers Assemble is going to be like Ultimate Spider-man.  I guess only time will tell.

[captmorgan72]

Spoiler

Who else instantly recognized Brent Spiner as the voice actor for Purple Man?

[oldmanwinters]

Any of you folks up to speed on this story?
http://www.comicbookmovie.com/news/?a=61993
and
http://www.bleedingcool.com/2012/06/19/the-boy-who-hated-ultimate-spider-man/

Allegedly, there was a single disgruntled animation fan who A) hates Ultimate Spider-man for replacing Spectacular SM, B) set up a bogus Marvel TV News website, and C) decided to "announce" that Avengers:EMH was cancelled and all the major news sites picked it up and ran with it.

I'm so confused now.

EDIT:
Apparently, the link to the site crimsonquill posted is the one under scrutiny:

Agent X (an insider of Marvel) has apparently spilled the beans for Marvel Animation Studios plans for 2012...

http://www.marveltvnews.com/2012/06/13/exclusive-agent-x-spills-the-bean-on-the-future-of-marvel-animation-and-did-he-just-mention-a-new-x-men-tv-series/

[Tomato]

I'd take that article with a grain of salt too. While we may not have gotten an official article about EMH bein "cancelled" exactly, other articles independant of that one have confirmed that there is a show called Avengers Assemble in the works, (such as TVGuide's interview with Loeb and Joe Q) and there were indications well before this that loeb wasn't a fan of avengers emh.

So yeah, there might be an awful lot of lies in those articles about just how bad usm is doing and marvel's other projects, I wouldn't be too optomistic about emh being safe just yet.

[Previsionary]

Mmkay. He may have started the rumors or whatever, but to say it was a one man war with all the negativity out there about USM is inane. He was probably one of the more vocal or outstanding, but I highly doubt he did everything himself. It's true that the show is not well liked by many fans who feel like the show is poorly written and panders to its intended fanbase. There's also evidence that Marvel/Q/Bendis aren't fond of negative comments being put on their pages about the show, as you can't find a single one, and one must admit that that is very odd. I understand the idea behind such a practice, but let's not pretend no one has nothing but positive things to say about the show... on the internet.

We've also seen what Marvel animation/TV has done to good shows in the past. This isn't the 90s where good shows had a chance of lasting 5 seasons and then being ripped off the air without a true finale like Spidey: TAS (or poor animation changes as was the case with X-men: TAS). Shows that come from Marvel these days are lucky to survive two seasons (26-52 episodes) and then they call it a wrap. Examples? MTV's Spider-man (13), Fan 4: World's Greatest Heroes, Wolverine & The X-men, Marvel Superhero Squad, and Spectacular Spidey all bit the dust at those numbers despite how well they may have been doing. Looks like Ironman: Armored Adventures might meet the same fate despite it finally coming into its own. Now, back in the day, lasting 52 episodes would be a major accomplishment for a show (X-men Evo), but with the way these show air their blocks now, it's not as great, especially when you take into account pacing of today's cartoons as opposed to the pacing of the shows that came in the 90s and early 2000s.

Toonzone confirms EMH is canceled: http://marvel.toonzone.net/news.php?action=fullnews&id=831

Marvel tv news responds to the rumors: http://www.marveltvnews.com/2012/06/20/responding-to-the-lies-that-bleedingcool-published-in-their-article-named-the-boy-who-hated-ultimate-spider-man/

[Talavar]

For the record: I hate Ultimate Spider-man.  I am not the guy who set up a Marvel TV news site.  Therefore, it wasn't a one-man smear campaign.

[captmorgan72]

Just watched Avengers Assemble. Is this the last episode of the series?

[Tomato]

Yes it was, apparently.

So, I just watched most of what remained of EMH season 2. With the exception of something they really couldn't do anything about (I'm sorry, even as someone who was OK with USM, that redub by Drake Bell in "Along Came a Spider" was just bad. The whole thing just felt forced.) the latter half of Season 2 was at least as good as the first, and it's a damn shame Loeb's got his head up his arse on this.

[captainawesome]

Just saw the last episodes. While I wish they'd do a third season, I'm glad they gave this show a true finale. It really ended on a good note.

[Talavar]

Well, I've seen the rest of Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes now, and it turned out pretty well.  Add another reason to the list of why Jeph Loeb should be forced to work as a Wal-mart greeter from here on out.  Spoilers & specific episode commentary follow:

Spoiler

The second half of the season was definitely an improvement over the first half.  The first half of the season introduced lots of new, ongoing threats, but resolved none of them until Secret Invasion, which was a mistake.  Skrull-Cap was dragged on for way too long.  From that point however, the season played out more like the first, with several mini-arcs - Vision & Ultron, the Red Skull and Winter Soldier, dealing with the Kree threat - and the standalone episodes were, for the most part, better handled than in the first half of the season.

Still, it wasn't all wine and roses.  Galactus and his heralds, while a suitably epic finale topic, seemed to be handled easier than a number of other threats, particularly those that took 2 or even 3 episodes to beat.  Most of the ongoing storylines were wrapped up, the Surtur one got a lot of development for never coming to a head (along with Civil War, to a lesser extent).  The Hulk was barely in the show past the ninth episode, dropping by to help defeat the Red Hulk, and then a little bit in the finale. 

Overall, Avengers never got to live up to its promise.  The first season had its flaws, but was a solid beginning.  The second season compounded some of those flaws with a shaky start to the season, and without there being a third season, we'll never know if this was a good show that could have become great.

[Tomato]

Spoiler

I get the impression that they'd intended to space some of those later story arcs into the next season (such as the Galactus arc) but they had to prioritize certain stories when they found out they were being cancelled. Had it continued, I'm pretty sure the Kree would have ended this season, and Galactus would have been the finale for next season.

[Talavar]

There's lots of Jeph Loeb spin/damage control coming out of Comic-Con re: the Avengers cartoons.  He apparently went so far as to suggest Earth's Mightiest & Assemble might share a continuity, and compared it to Brian Michael Bendis taking over writing of the Avengers comic.  Am I supposed to feel better about that?  Ugh.

[Previsionary]

There's lots of Jeph Loeb spin/damage control coming out of Comic-Con re: the Avengers cartoons.  He apparently went so far as to suggest Earth's Mightiest & Assemble might share a continuity, and compared it to Brian Michael Bendis taking over writing of the Avengers comic.  Am I supposed to feel better about that?  Ugh.

That makes me want to give the show LESS of a chance. He should be quiet.

[oldmanwinters]

There's lots of Jeph Loeb spin/damage control coming out of Comic-Con re: the Avengers cartoons.  He apparently went so far as to suggest Earth's Mightiest & Assemble might share a continuity, and compared it to Brian Michael Bendis taking over writing of the Avengers comic.  Am I supposed to feel better about that?  Ugh.

Yeesh... dude needs to make up his mind.

To quote the theme song,
"Our world's about to break, tormented and attacked.
Lost from when we wake, with no way to go back..."

[captainawesome]

^ Lol, that made my day. I do kind of wonder why they didn't just make EMH season 3 and just shift the avengers roster to match the movie. It'd make the fans way less irritated.

[Tomato]

There's lots of Jeph Loeb spin/damage control coming out of Comic-Con re: the Avengers cartoons.  He apparently went so far as to suggest Earth's Mightiest & Assemble might share a continuity, and compared it to Brian Michael Bendis taking over writing of the Avengers comic.  Am I supposed to feel better about that?  Ugh.

That makes me want to give the show LESS of a chance. He should be quiet.

... Damn you loeb, you're making me agree 100% with prev. I could forgive you for the Red Hulk overhyping, the nonsensical direction Heroes went after you came on board, the Ultimate universe garbage, maybe even (with time and mental counseling) forgive your for the nonsense with EMH... but damnit loeb, making me agree with Prev is unforgivable!

In all seriousness though, I'm really not regretting my decision to boycott marvel tv and all things related to it. I was reasonably ok with USM, but truthfully it hasn't impacted my life enough that I notice its absence. Marvel can call me when Loeb is fired and/or Avengers Assemble is cancelled.