Mod making for newbies?

[life_matrix]

I'm serious about starting work on a mod of my own. I started with a cool mod idea which I've already written out in a "mod development doc." I've not only written up much of the plot, but some of the details for several of the missions.

But I'm still pretty new to the inner workings of Freedom Force. Any advice or online guides you can recommend? (Some links would be nice.)

I've already downloaded the Freedom Force Editor and read through the official Irrational documentation. And I've read a couple threads on Freedom Reborn about this. But since most of the old threads are still missing a lot of the former info on mod making seems scarce.

I've made several new skins (haven't released them yet) and working on several more. I also plan to play around with NifSkope and might even modify a few meshes.

I don't have any knowledge of python code. But I am a bit familiar with C++ and BASIC programming. With some tutorials I think I could learn just enough to try my hand at it.

I think I have decent art skills, if I say so myself. (I was always good in art classes.) And I could try a few character voices, but I don't know how convincing they'd be.

While I don't know much about music composition, I'm not entirely tone deaf. And I think I know where to look for help with the music.

[life_matrix]

For the first couple of missions I plan to borrow some material (skins, meshes, maps, etc) from the original Freedom Force missions. (The beginning of the story takes place in the Freedom Force universe and it will use some of the FF characters, too.) So this should help simplify things while I learn the ropes. And make it more likely to actually have something to show.

But really, with all the skins, meshes, FX, sound effects and the like available today modders should have little trouble finding excellent resources. (Assuming they get permission to use them, of course!)

Still, I think that if someone wants to make a good mod and get it finished in a decent amount of time, then it would be smart to ask for help... Either just for advice or to try to make the mod a team effort. (Perhaps the problem with the latter is that everyone who would be interested in mod making just wants to go with their own mod ideas??)

So why is it that several of the mods I'm familiar with are the work of one person - or nearly so? While some mods do have a list of credits for skins, meshes, FX, voices and the like I get the impression that the plot and missions for many of these were designed by just one person.

And why don't I see any threads here in the Mod area in which several members collaborate on a mod as a team? In fact, I don't see any threads in which a mod author asks the community for new mission ideas. (I'm not saying such threads don't exist, just that I haven't seen them yet.) Perhaps such threads aren't done because it might function as a spoiler for those who haven't played it yet? But even threads in which the mod author asks for feedback seem scarce.

[joemama]

But since most of the old threads are still missing

Alas, this is the biggest problem, Dr. Mike (the FF Legend), put lots of tutorials on python, but they are gone for the moment.  I saved a couple of them, so PM me your e-mail if you want me to send them to you (3-4 articles in HTML format).

Make sure you also download FFX (for either version).  If you're running FFVTTR, you may consider an EZ Script Mod.  It's much easier than python, you can still do quite a bit with it, and it would be the first (full-length) EZ Script Mod, so you'd be a bit of a pioneer.

just my two cents

JM

[Previsionary]

I couldve sworn someone posted most of dr mike's helpful guides back up. *shrugs*
Joe, if you have them, maybe it'd be a good idea to put them on the wiki so they arent lost again...atleast it'd be in more than one location/source so it'd be harder to lose.

Anyway, if you check on Freedom Asylum, you'll find my basic tutorial that everyone forgets about. But yeah, python isn't "hard", it's a lot of experimenting and figuring out "how" to learn it. A lot of people claim it's hard because they see all that code and it blows their mind. Taking it a step at a time is the best thing to do as well as practicing it. And if I recall correctly, python is suppose to be the "easiest" programming language to learn.

As for mod teams...a team project takes much more time if everyone doesn't have the same level of dedication or time. I work more or less alone, but I have a mod team I turn to from time to time for various bits of random stuffage. When I need skin help, I always ask Syn, Volt, Rick, or B...same with meshes. Since I learned more code and have a better working knowledge of it than my initial core team, I usually turn to Lude and/or Furie (not so much now). When I need dialogue/mod plot help/analysis, I turn to my oh so helpful TPE, Middy, Rick, and B. Then of course there's the playtesters. :P. So, though it may seem like a solo project to people outside the circle, it usually isn't.

As for feedback, I always ask for some type of feedback when my mod thread was around. It's just the community members don't always give feedback or they don't do it in the open. I know I've gotten tons via pm and I know for a fact KKHO gave me some my last mod. As for mission ideas, it's kinda hard to take someone elses ideas and make them into a suitable mod/mission when they usually don't know the inner workings of making a mission. It's not impossible...just tough. But then again, I rely on TPE with mission ideas when I don't like my own. :P

Anyway, if you're super serious about this adventure. You can ask the friendly folks around here for help and I'm sure they'll jump on it, yo. ^_^

[catwhowalksbyhimself]

As an illustration about the team thing:

My Liberty Bay mod was supposed to be a group effort, and to an extent it is, but once that planning stages were over, I basically had to take it over and run with it, because no one else was.

Now mind you, I have no artistic talent, and most of the other folks do, so just about everyone has something in it, but I've had to do all of the non-artistic work myself simply because I can't get anyone else to do it.

[HumanTon]

Make sure you also download FFX (for either version).  If you're running FFVTTR, you may consider an EZ Script Mod.  It's much easier than python, you can still do quite a bit with it, and it would be the first (full-length) EZ Script Mod, so you'd be a bit of a pioneer.

Here's another vote for EXScript. It lives up to its name, which makes it fast to put things together. Even if you don't end up using it for the final mod it can be a handy tool to get something up and running quickly.

[life_matrix]

If you're running FFVTTR, you may consider an EZ Script Mod.  It's much easier than python, you can still do quite a bit with it, and it would be the first (full-length) EZ Script Mod, so you'd be a bit of a pioneer.

Hmm... That sounds tempting. But I had originally planned on making it for the original Freedom Force. (I'm embarassed to say I haven't played FFvTR yet. Both of my PCs need new graphics cards and my faster unit needs a lot of work.)

Question: Does FFvTR have the capability of allowing the option of multiplayer teamwork in a campaign? I thought I read somewhere that it has better multiplayer capability.

[Epimethee]

If you're running FFVTTR, you may consider an EZ Script Mod.  It's much easier than python, you can still do quite a bit with it, and it would be the first (full-length) EZ Script Mod, so you'd be a bit of a pioneer.

Hmm... That sounds tempting. But I had originally planned on making it for the original Freedom Force.

Opinions will vary, but from my admittedly FFX-biased viewpoint, FF1 is a deadend. There's not nearly as much new work done for it as for FFvsTTR (or stuff compatible with both games).

(I'm embarassed to say I haven't played FFvTR yet. Both of my PCs need new graphics cards and my faster unit needs a lot of work.)

If your computer is in any way decent, you should be fine. FWIW, mine is 5-year old (and was not top-line even then); once I invested a few dollars in updating the graphic card (a not-so-new ATI 9600) and the RAM, the game played very well.

Question: Does FFvTR have the capability of allowing the option of multiplayer teamwork in a campaign? I thought I read somewhere that it has better multiplayer capability.

It has better capabilities, but co-op play, sadly, isn't part of it, IIRC. Mind you, almost nobody plays FF or FFvsTTR multiplayer anyway.

[UnkoMan]

As an illustration about the team thing:

My Liberty Bay mod was supposed to be a group effort, and to an extent it is, but once that planning stages were over, I basically had to take it over and run with it, because no one else was.

Now mind you, I have no artistic talent, and most of the other folks do, so just about everyone has something in it, but I've had to do all of the non-artistic work myself simply because I can't get anyone else to do it.

I do feel a bit of a need to respond to this. I enjoy the Liberty Bay world a rather lot. It got me back into skinning and really helped improve my skills in that area. Unfourtunately that was the only area I had any tallents in. I've tried modding before that, and a bit after... all of it ended in disaterous failure.

If I was able to do it, however, I would have been willing to give you a hand with missions and whatnot. I assume this is the same for quite a few people. I may, however, be looking into this EZscripting thing more (although I'll admit confusion when I first saw it). I assume LibBay will still be done traditionally.

[catwhowalksbyhimself]

No, I'm not blaming anybody, and you in particular have done a huge amount of work on LB.

But I have gotten several other offers that have been dropped or never come through that you don't know about.  Mostly it's because said person had other FF-related projects.

In no cases did I say I had a problem with any of that.  It's just the way things are.

[UnkoMan]

Well that is a shame. I do have to say I am very greatful for your continued efforts on.

See groups are... Groups are hard to do something like this. Over the internet, even harder, since you can't just pass it back and forth and do a little work on it. I'd still say they are good for rallying support and urging you to keep going.

But man, I'm totally derailing this. Sorry.

[Lunarman]

One last off-topic post. I feel that all mod teams are like LB. Once everyone has commited their artistic side (maps/skins/portaits) then all that's left is the sticking together. That consists of scripting and datting. Now datting is the long and boring process, writing a script only takes 3 hours if you really sit down and concentrate on it. If someone were part of a team just to do the dat work, their job would be ever so boring. It's just the way it is