X-Men '97

[BentonGrey]

Howdy folks, I just watched the first episode, and here is a little, spoiler-free review.

I was excited and more than a little nervous to watch X-Men '97, the revival of the 3rd greatest superhero show of all time and a childhood favorite of mine, and then I was surprised and delighted to discover that Lady Grey actually wanted to watch it with me.  X-Men was a favorite of hers, too.  So, we watched the first episode tonight, and as soon as the episode began, with an almost shot-for-shot remake of the original intro, complete with a remake of the awesome original theme, we found ourselves grinning from nostalgia.
 
It was actually pretty good.  It's not quite got the same magic; the writing isn't as smooth (although that may improve as they go), and the animation isn't as good, though it is more consistent.  I'm actually pleasantly surprised about the animation, as it looked pretty rough in the trailers.  It's actually solid and even good at times, though it has a slightly stiff feel occasionally. 

Most importantly, however, the show feels and SOUNDS right.  I practically jumped out of my seat in excitement when I heard Cal Dodds, the Platonic ideal of Wolverine, calling someone "Bub" again after all these years.  The voice cast for the original show was perfect, and, amazingly, they've actually got 90% of the original cast back to reprise their roles.  Almost all of them sound like they've stepped right out of the 90s.  The writing might not be quite there, but the voice cast still has most of their magic, from Storm's operatic pronouncements as she uses her powers, to Wolverine's hair-trigger, to Beast's verbose eloquence. 

The first episode was a solid introduction to the premise and the one-year-later setting, and it seems like they are doing some interesting things, even if the A plot felt like a retread without a huge amount of innovation to offer.  The overarching plot elements are more promising and there is a sense of growth with the characters.  They are where we left them at the end of the show, with five years of development and change, not reset to 0 (take note, Star Wars). 

Something I particularly enjoyed is that they are trying to dial back Cyclops's jerk-ness and dial up his awesomeness, giving him some really cool moments and a smoothness he almost never had in the original toon.  That's probably a good idea, as everyone always hated Cyclops, but he's core to the team.  And, when I read the original comics years after the cartoon, I realized there was a lot more to the character than I had known from TAS.  It's nice to see that filtering into the new show.

The action and the scale of the X-Men have been turned up a bit, to the point that it feels a little over-the-top, even for a superhero show.  There was a groundedness to the original show (as much as a setting with flying weather witches and feral beast-men can be grounded), but the first episode seems to be indulging in "rule-of-cool" moments a lot more than the original show did, and not for dramatic effect, but purely for spectacle. 

For example, as you may have seen in the trailer, at one point in the climactic fight, Gambit jumps onto Wolverine's back and rides him like a horse (which looks odd), then charges Logan's claws with his powers, setting up a teamwork triple play that is pretty extreme.  It feels a bit like those scenes were written by a bunch of fans sitting around, saying, "Wouldn't it be cool if..."

That's not necessarily a terrible thing, but it is a bit of a tonal shift in terms of the action.  It makes the whole thing feel more cartoon-y and less realistic (within the parameters of their world), and your mileage may vary. 

So, all-in-all, it's a very promising start, and I hope the rest of the series will be at least as good.  I'm quite curious to see where they'll go.


What did y'all think?

[Tomato]

I am looking forward to it every week, and I'm interested to see where they go. According to the titles, we apparently Mojo next week, which I'm usually ehhhhh on but I trust the show enough to see what they do.

As for specifics, without going into spoilers, I liked how they handled Madelyn, but I felt it was resolved too quickly. And yeah, short of it taking up half the show there's no great solution for that.

[BentonGrey]

Glad you're liking it, 'Mato (Howdy, by the way!).  Interesting!  I loved the Mojo episode from the original show (though I think a little probably goes a long way).

Lady Grey and I have decided to rewatch the original so she can remember it better before we continue with the new one, so we'll be a bit behind.

[mac402]

Nice to see a topic about this so I'll share my two cents. I didn't have high hopes for the show when I heard about it. I was sure they were going to butcher it, but it is actually quite good. 4 episodes aired and I still think it's quite qood. Stays true to the '92 show and, like its predecessor, new stories are heavely based on their comic counterparts. It does seem the show was designed with a very strong emphasis on nostalgia. You'll find casette players, arcade games, Storm verbally calling the weather when using her powers etc. Animation is more fluid then the original but character designs, while very close to the original, are worse imo. Mostly this can be seen in how the faces are drawn. Everything is more anime-like although you'll not notice it at first. Other than that I agree that the pacing is too fast and it shows (though this is due to a season having only 10 episodes iirc). The episodes are a bit longer than usual lasting 30 minutes. The pattern right now seems to be every episode is dedicated to a different team member. 1 was Cyke, 2 was Mags, 3 was Jean and 4 was Jubes. There is indication of a Storm focused story upcoming. There might be some overarching plot cooking but we'll have to see yet. So generally yeah, according to me one the best marvel related stuff released nowadays (yeah, I know the competition is almost nonexistent by now but still...). Enjoy watching this guys!

That's probably a good idea, as everyone always hated Cyclops, but he's core to the team.

That was the sentiment? I always thought he was well liked by comic book readers at least. People who knew X-Men only from the movies are another matter but TAS was always pretty close to the comic material.

[Tomato]

I mean... I like the guy, but Cyclops has always been low key a kinda terrible person. This is a man who went "oh, I miss my X-men adventures and my old GF is alive, I guess I'll just abandon my wife and baby son" and just left them. Even in '97, after his whole speech about not wanting to be a part of sending his son to the future because he was abandoned by his own father... he then IMMEDIATELY walks out and abandons his son for what little time he has left to be with him because seeing his son leave is too hard on HIM. Comic Cyclops spent years regretting the former (and I suspect we'll see 97 Scott regret the latter) and he does honestly try to do the right thing, but it leads to him being seen as hypocritical.

Also there's the Wolverine/Jean shippers. Personally I feel like that relationship in both cartoons is VERY one sided (Jean never really indicates she loves him more than a friend, and Wolverine is more than a little clingy) and always low-key shipped Wolverine/Storm after their AoA episode, but a lot of fans feel Wolverine is entitled to Jean and Scott is this loser standing in his way. The movies certainly didn't help that impression, but it was present in the cartoon as well.

[mac402]

Yeah, him abandoning his family was definitely one of his lowest moments. I blame it on bad writing though. Kind of good that they downplayed it in this adaptation, but then the existance of Madelyn isn't really justified here since Jean didn't die. In comics she was meant to give Scott a sense of consolation and a happy ending after losing Jean. Then another writer brings Jean back and we get an awkward "return to status quo" plot. I always got the feeling that originally Madelyne was supposed to be some reincarnation or such.

Regarding the Wolverine/Jean/Cyclops triangle, I think that got dropped way in the Claremont era. While not exactly written as friends, Logan and Scott grew to mutually respect each other. In the 90s Logan was replaced with Betsy and then of course with Emma. It wasn't until the movie where interest in a Logan/Jean romance got rekindled again.

But otherwise Cyclops' stint in the comics isn't bad, he gets quite a lot of character development from "teachers pet" to an autonomous leader. The Utopia era is his peak. I remember he was considered  cool back then. I also heard opinions of people calling him relatable since his powerset is rather simple and otherwise he serves as a stock human character.

[BentonGrey]

Mac, I was referring specifically to the show.  That's what I meant about finding a new appreciation for him when I read the comics after the fact.  Basically everyone I know who watched the show but didn't read the comics hates poor Cyke.

As for Scott being "low key a kind of terrible person," I certainly wouldn't say he always was.  There's a lot of history and a lot of water under that particular bridge before Madelyne shows up, and he's a pretty good person before that.  I stopped reading the classic book around that time, so I've never seen the really terrible stuff.  His generally noble and sympathetic portrayal from the original run and the major portion of the Claremont run is what made me care about him.

Wolverine/Jean: Haha, I was absolutely one of those shippers as a kid, and, as an overly angsty outsider who hadn't yet figured out how to talk to girls, I loved the angsty ridiculousness of that whole element of the show.  Now-a-days, I'm with you, 'Mato.  Logan and Storm make WAY more sense and would be generally way less toxic.  I do think there are some indications that Jean has feelings for Logan, though they are subtle and ambiguous enough that you can also simply read them as her having compassion on the guy's struggles with his demons (a classic beat itself).

[Tomato]

In the comics I'd say it's definitely more of a thing, but I've rewatched the 90s cartoon a few times and like... Jean humors Logan a lot, even has some platonic affection for him, but she CONSISTENTLY chooses Scott through the entire show, and not just because he's the good, stable one like in the movies. She doesn't love Logan, she loves Scott, and she is VERY clear on that... when she's not passing out dramatically.

Frankly, I didn't even go INTO some of the worst Cyclops stuff. Again, I love this character, but pretty much everything from his Apocalypse possession to basically EVERYTHING to do with him in the Morrison era, to his actions throughout AvX, creeping on teenage Jean during the time travel shenanigans... Abandoning his child and then regretting it almost immediately is like, not even top 10 worst things he's done.

And yeah, most of that is just poor writing, but even in the beginning that twinge of selfishness and self pity was a defining trait of the character (Oh, curse my powers, I can never be with Jean! Even though she's fully aware of the risks and wants to be with me anyway, I'm taking that choice away from her because of my own hangups and insecurities!). I don't begrudge him that, he's human, and he's always tried to atone for his mistakes. It's why I love him as a character, even when he's running around as a Magneto-lite. But I also recognize that he DOES need a character like Wolverine to call him on his BS from time to time.

[BentonGrey]

In the comics I'd say it's definitely more of a thing, but I've rewatched the 90s cartoon a few times and like... Jean humors Logan a lot, even has some platonic affection for him, but she CONSISTENTLY chooses Scott through the entire show, and not just because he's the good, stable one like in the movies. She doesn't love Logan, she loves Scott, and she is VERY clear on that... when she's not passing out dramatically.

Ha!  I think that's basically fair, 'Mato, but I think there's space to read some hesitancy into her interactions from time to time.  In general, though, I agree that the strongest reading is platonic friendship and misinterpreted concern.

Frankly, I didn't even go INTO some of the worst Cyclops stuff. Again, I love this character, but pretty much everything from his Apocalypse possession to basically EVERYTHING to do with him in the Morrison era, to his actions throughout AvX, creeping on teenage Jean during the time travel shenanigans... Abandoning his child and then regretting it almost immediately is like, not even top 10 worst things he's done.

And yeah, most of that is just poor writing, but even in the beginning that twinge of selfishness and self pity was a defining trait of the character (Oh, curse my powers, I can never be with Jean! Even though she's fully aware of the risks and wants to be with me anyway, I'm taking that choice away from her because of my own hangups and insecurities!). I don't begrudge him that, he's human, and he's always tried to atone for his mistakes. It's why I love him as a character, even when he's running around as a Magneto-lite. But I also recognize that he DOES need a character like Wolverine to call him on his BS from time to time.

Sheesh!  Ha, yeah, I feel pretty good about stopping my reading when I did...

[mac402]

Lol . So, you don't want to read the modern excellence in storytelling about humankind-hating mutant supremacist cult cheerfuly collaborating with genocidal monsters like Sinister and Apocalypse X-Men? How odd... 

I brought up Utopia era since it felt like the last viable effort to salvage the shitshow its become, at least before AvX hit. Come to think of it Marvel has become a rather terrible place post Civil War. Another reason why X'97 feels like a return to good old days.

I wonder though how many more stories from the time period are left to use? Chronologically the show is now in the Claremont 80s with Magneto on the team et al. But TAS has used a lot of 80-90s material already. There was The Twelve, Magneto & the Acolytes, Phalanx, Genosha, Angel becoming Death etc. etc. Many more I probably don't remember.

[Tomato]

So the exact verbiage I would use to express my reaction are banned by forum rules, but how was this just episode 5!?! This is season cliffhanger nonsense.

Episode 5

So I have been ragging on Scott, but honestly? I kinda feel for his position this episode. Man just lost his son, and he's been talking to the only other person who understands what he's going through, and he's getting ragged on for cheating on the "real" Jean when, frankly, we don't even know if Jean was switched before the wedding. And I get it, Jean's feeling violated and doesn't know what is real and is looking for Scott to be her anchor, but like... Dude just lost his child and is CLEARLY NOT OK RIGHT NOW.

Not saying Jean isn't right to feel vulnerable or to have lapses in judgement, but this isn't her catching Scott having psychic Emma love time like in the comics, this is a father having conversations with the mother of his child. 100% on team Scott here.

[mac402]

Poor guy, lost his son, now he may loose his relationship.
Things took a bad turn really quick. This was the most grim episode of X-Men I've ever watched. Not sure it's a good thing. We'll just have to wait to see.

[Tomato]

So there's a clip posted on the ME Youtube channel that I *guess* is somehow from episode 6 (Episode 6 is supposed to be lifedeath so how that nonsense plays into it I have no idea)

Marvel Entertainment Clip

So it's a small scene with Deathbird bullying Ronin the accuser (Good) and in her entourage is Vulcan, which... excuse me!?! We haven't even resolved Havok being Scott's brother yet (he showed up in the Iceman episode and they set it up like "hey our powers don't affect each other, weird" and then he's NEVER SEEN AGAIN). What is this nonsense.

[mac402]

Episode 6 landed.

Spoiler

Looks like Vulcan is just a cameo. Not surpirising with the way the speed through storylines. On another note I like how Storm at the end the episode ditches the mohawk haircut and returns not to her 90s white costume she wore in TAS but to the frickin classic original design from comics!