The Removal of the Freedom Force Resource Forums

[cmdrkoenig67]

I'm totally hurt, angry and thoroughly depressed (as are many of you, I'm sure)by what's happened...But truthfully, is there a point to these forums without the FF section?  Sports?  Y'all are killing me with the sports talk...Blech.  I visit the comics section and the movie/music/tv section from time to time, but I'm really here for the FF section...I'm here for FF, the FF community and the game's mod-ability.  

So I guess there will be no mods (or maps) from me based on Marvel characters/settings (or DC, etc...)...

Dana

[daglob]

Jeeze! I don't log in for a few hours and look what happens.

I didn't even know IPS was banned. Shows you how much attention I pay. His site is gone, by the way (or at least the link I have to it is dead), so I guess he can honestly state that he is not hosting any copyrighted material. I am kind of sad for him too. He is too young to see that road he is on could twist back around to one of those bridges he has nuked in his wake. At the same time, people who were ambivalent about him previously now have very definite opinions of him.

Well, most of the stuff I post is of characters who are from companies that haven't existed for over fifty years, but still!

Awhile back, Conde-Nast (edit: actually, it was their lawyers, if I remember correctly) sent letters of intent to serve Cease and Desist Orders to several pulp hero fan sites. Some of them posted copies of the stories, others just posted copies of some covers or interior illustrations. All were apparently painted with the same brush, even though none were making money directly off the copyrighted material (advertising may have been a different matter). So, yes, many of us do have something to worry about (although, as I understand it, usually, if you remove the copyrighted material from your site of your own free will when asked to, that is the end of it).

Hey! JP: don't take it too hard. We all care, we just have to crack jokes sometimes so we don't start crying. Or cursing.

Those who talk about quitting-yeah, this kind of thing leeches all the fun out of something, but that is what this act was intended to do. It is an infantile, immature, and spiteful action, intended to make as much trouble for as many people as possible. Including those who had nothing to do with the events that preceeded it, and even some those who were originally on his side.

I don't know what else to say.

[djfredski]

   Who would do such a thing?
why would that person do that to us?
what next for our community?

[cmdrkoenig67]

Jeeze! I don't log in for a few hours and look what happens.

I didn't even know IPS was banned. Shows you how much attention I pay. His site is gone, by the way (or at least the link I have to it is dead), so I guess he can honestly state that he is not hosting any copyrighted material.

Nope...It's still there...

http://ya-media.com/

http://ya-media.com/pages/gamework.html

[cmdrkoenig67]

  Who would do such a thing?
why would that person do that to us?
what next for our community?

Who would do this?  Have you not read the thread?

Dana

[wickerman]

i didn;t really want to get to nuts and bolts here, and i am not a lawyer (though I have studied law in college here and there as a business major), but I am a writer and deal with copyright issues...   keep in mind I am no expert...


The copyright owner has the right to assert his/her/its claim regardless of whether or not you are profiting from using their materials.  There are fair-use exceptions (education, reviews and parody are common).  So, if you draw a picture of Wonder Woman with a carrot for a nose DC can't sue you - its a joke.  If you quote a few lines from Harry Potter in a review, J.K. Rowling can't sue you - that's fair use in the review.  Sadly, modding the Sims, Freedom Force or whatever is not fair use.  The fact that no one sells the skins is meaningless.

Now with the doom and gloom out of the way, let's look at some more heart warming stuff.  DC (for instance) is not going to sue you.  Period.  Why not?  you ask.  They could!  I'll be ruined!  They have big shot lawyers and stuff!  Exactly.  Why the hell would a big shot company sue *you*.  Now *you* is a bit of a guesstimation on my part here - I don't know *you*.  Let's assume *you* are just like me.  DC wouldn't sue me because they are not going to waste time and money suing someone with no money.  That's why OJ Simpson got sued but Ted Bundy did not.  What are you going to sue Ted Bundy for?  OJ was worth millions - suing him had a point.  Suing me is a waste.  Even if the judge awards DC 100 billion dollars, I don't have 100 billion dollars or anti-copyright infringement insurance, so DC would be out of luck.  Sure they get a piece of paper that says they win, but good luck with that.

So those who are worried - don't - at least not for your personal well being.  You may lose the ability to distribute your skins and stuff, but if you are ever hit with a C&D just do what it says and it will end.  No one is going to take your house in a lawsuit  (they can't take your house anyway - at least not in NY where I live    )  So relax and let's hope this all works out.

[daglob]

Jeeze! I don't log in for a few hours and look what happens.

I didn't even know IPS was banned. Shows you how much attention I pay. His site is gone, by the way (or at least the link I have to it is dead), so I guess he can honestly state that he is not hosting any copyrighted material.

Nope...It's still there...

http://ya-media.com/

http://ya-media.com/pages/gamework.html

I didn't know he had this one. The link I had was to a FF only site.

[UnkoMan]

So I guess there will be no mods (or maps) from me based on Marvel characters/settings (or DC, etc...)...

Dana

Ahhh... Just do original characters now. It's not like we're in short supply there.


But, as to this... all I can say is dang. I didn't post much anymore, but I still kept track of every skin thread. I also quite enjoyed seeing what everybody else was doing and maybe filling or finding the occasional request. Heck, I never even checked the general discussion board, really.

...dang.

[Sledgehammer]

Those thinking that this ain't worth it anymore, please, reconsider it when you calm yourselves a little.

This is no time for rash reactions. If once you've calmly thought this through, you still consider you must stop skinning/meshing/whatever, that's a decision I can understand. This kind of stuff makes it not fun anymore. If, on the other hand, you decide to continue with your amazing creations, I think the rest of us will appreciate it greatly.

I think we must stick together as a community during these rough times. I am affected too by this copyright infringement, but I would like to continue with my Voicepacks once this situation gets solved. Hopefully, I will be able to announce them in FR, as I have grown fond of this place, so much that I decided to return after being absent for a year because I really like it here - And I like it not only for the goods, but also (and especially) for the friendly and fantastic atmosphere.

Don't let the turmoil discourage you. While there is hope to solve this issue, I'm keeping my positive attitude. At all times.

[President Raygun]

So does anybody think he's reading this thread, because if he is 

[crimsonquill]

I'm right behind Sledge on this one...  I'm going to ride out the storm and see what happens on the other side. I'm not giving up what I enjoy making (voicepacks) and nobody should quit because they are worried about the fallout of what happened here.

I'm happy that so many people have visited FR today and really showing support that this site is needed no matter which form it has to take on.

- CQ

[zuludelta]

I'm totally hurt, angry and thoroughly depressed (as are many of you, I'm sure)by what's happened...But truthfully, is there a point to these forums without the FF section?

I don't know if you meant this as a rhetorical question or not but yeah, there is a point to these forums without the FF section. I've had some very intelligent and enlightening discussions about comics right here in the General Discussion board. And these are discussions that I don't think I would have been able to have, say, over at the Newsarama or Comic Book Resources forums where I think the average poster is probably a bit younger and more prone to "fan-talk" (not to mention the fact that the large size of their respective communities means a thread could very easily buried by a ton of "Marvel sucks!" and "DC sucks!" threads in a few hours).

[cmdrkoenig67]

He's burned his bridges with everyone in the community now (since he's hurt all of us).  The sooner he knows it, the better.

I hope Freedom Reborn will be reborn yet again...Someday.

Dana

[cmdrkoenig67]

I'm totally hurt, angry and thoroughly depressed (as are many of you, I'm sure)by what's happened...But truthfully, is there a point to these forums without the FF section?

I don't know if you meant this as a rhetorical question or not but yeah, there is a point to these forums without the FF section. I've had some very intelligent and enlightening discussions about comics right here in the General Discussion board. And these are discussions that I don't think I would have been able to have, say, over at the Newsarama or Comic Book Resources forums where I think the average poster is probably a bit younger and more prone to "fan-talk" (not to mention the fact that the large size of their respective communities means a thread could very easily buried by a ton of "Marvel sucks!" and "DC sucks!" threads in a few hours).

Perhaps I exaggerated a bit, but did you catch the rest of my post?  For me, the FF part is an important part...It's why I joined almost 5 years ago.  It's a great community with some great people, but I joined to take part in my enjoyment of FF and it's mod possibilities.

Dana

[Diablo]

I hope too I want download some skins!

[Green Hornet]

Sad that this has happened, but I do not think anything will come up with DC or Marvel.  There is not competition here and they are not losing money.  The way the economy is this site could motivate a person to go buy their comics.  As long as their characters are not displayed out of character.  This site is made up of a lot of their fans and it would be bad PR. But in the meantime this site http://fabricadeherois.blogspot.com/ you can design your own heroes even if you do not have artistic talent, like me. I believe things will come around and everything will be back up. 

[zuludelta]

Perhaps I exaggerated a bit, but did you catch the rest of my post?  For me, the FF part is the important part...It's why I joined almost 5 years ago.  It's a great community with some great people, but I joined to take part in my enjoyment of FF and it's mod possibilities.

Dana

I know you're on edge because of recent events, but there's no need to get snippy. You asked if there was a point to the forums without the Freedom Force section and I indulged your question by replying as to how the forums are relevant to me without the FF section. I didn't say that you should enjoy the forums sans the FF material. In no way did I imply that your appreciation of the boards should not be lessened because of the loss of the FF resources board. I was trying to offer you something to hold on to and appreciate about what remains of the boards.

[livewyre1014]

I know that I just recently returned to these forums for a long absence...but I still felt like a part of this community.  It is stunning to me personally that someone can be this petty over nothing.  Also, I find it very sad that the homage we fans pay to the heroes who have inspired us for years could be construde as copyright infringement.  Anyway, I won't rant and raise a ruckus...I just want to say that I hope the community survives this, I really appreciate the opprotunity to share my original ideas with like minded individuals...and I do believe in karma, so he who is responsible(who I shall not name due to lack of respect) will see what comes around goes around.

Hang in there heroes, even when we face bleak times, we can stand together and whether the tide of any Crisis.

the one and only(and saddened)
LiveWyre(Barret Lee Mehaffey)

[bearded]

don't panic.
general rule, hitchhikers guide to the galaxy.
we've been through the cease and desist panic before.  and i remember, the only ppl who got them were darkjared, with skindex and sims skins, and an individual received a personal letter from eisner regarding his 'spirit' character not carrying guns!
we are smaller than we were before, and fr has complied completely.

[freedomforceforever]

As a long time lurker, I just wanna say thanks to you guys for keeping this game alive. And getting me back into comics.


Just in case this is the end.

Hope it isn't.

[cmdrkoenig67]

Perhaps I exaggerated a bit, but did you catch the rest of my post?  For me, the FF part is the important part...It's why I joined almost 5 years ago.  It's a great community with some great people, but I joined to take part in my enjoyment of FF and it's mod possibilities.

Dana

I know you're on edge because of recent events, but there's no need to get snippy. You asked if there was a point to the forums without the Freedom Force section and I indulged your question by replying as to how the forums are relevant to me without the FF section. I didn't say that you should enjoy the forums sans the FF material. In no way did I imply that your appreciation of the boards should not be lessened because of the loss of the FF resources board. I was trying to offer you something to hold on to and appreciate about what remains of the boards.

I think you're reading snippiness, where there is none, Zu...I didn't mean it to sound that way.

Dana

[Diablo]

this cant be the end!

[Lionheart]

There's really no reason for FR to "die."

Remember that Irrational employees have posted here before, and they have encouraged modding and provided tools to do so. So anything we do with the FF universe or any other original material is fine and does not fall under the wet blanket of IPS' vindictiveness.

There's no reason to stop making maps, FX, skins, meshes, etc.

Hopefully Vertex and others on the FU forum will still post here and let us know when new material is released there. I won't be joining that forum, not just because IPS is there, but because of the stated format. I like the fact that FR has always been moderated and "family friendly." My little girl loves to see the skins and meshes (and is a *huge* C6 fan  ), so that means a lot to me.

FU is billed as, well, less family friendly. That in itself knocks it out for me. Nothing against the folks there at all, just a matter of personal preference. Family comes first, and FF is something my daughter and I share.

[House Quake]

There's still Vertex's forum but I don't care for it as much and IPS IS over there. I wonder if they know about this over there yet.

Of course they do. Everyone associated with administering and supporting that forum supports IPS and it's existence is a direct effect of IPS's banning.

I'm a mod there... and I'm just learning about this now.

Don't make assumptions about who supports what actions.

[Diablo]

There's really no reason for FR to "die."

Remember that Irrational employees have posted here before, and they have encouraged modding and provided tools to do so. So anything we do with the FF universe or any other original material is fine and does not fall under the wet blanket of IPS' vindictiveness.

There's no reason to stop making maps, FX, skins, meshes, etc.

Hopefully Vertex and others on the FU forum will still post here and let us know when new material is released there. I won't be joining that forum, not just because IPS is there, but because of the stated format. I like the fact that FR has always been moderated and "family friendly." My little girl loves to see the skins and meshes (and is a *huge* C6 fan  ), so that means a lot to me.

FU is billed as, well, less family friendly. That in itself knocks it out for me. Nothing against the folks there at all, just a matter of personal preference. Family comes first, and FF is something my daughter and I share.

yeah freedom reborn will never die!

[Jakew]

So does anybody think he's reading this thread, because if he is 

Definitely. If you're cowardly enough to pull this type of stuff, you'd want to sneak back and look at the results. Hopefully IPS' real social life is less catastrophic than his virtual one. Then again, if he had a social life, he probably wouldn't spend so much time trying to shut down an internet forum...

In all honesty, I can't see DC and Marvel caring about Freedom Reborn. Employees of Irrational have posted here, as have Marvel writers (such as a Fabien Nicenza). These companies don't care about the relatively small community that creates mods for an old game sheerly because they love comics.

Besides, Freedom Reborn is indestructible, and impervious to viruses, self-righteous jerks and everything short of nuclear fallout.

[crimsonquill]

There's still Vertex's forum but I don't care for it as much and IPS IS over there. I wonder if they know about this over there yet.

Of course they do. Everyone associated with administering and supporting that forum supports IPS and it's existence is a direct effect of IPS's banning.

Whoa.. whoa.. whoa, assumptions are not good things...

Just because IPS works at the place that hosts that site doesn't mean that members there agree with IPS's actions or what is going down with FR. So lets not be spreading rumors because you are not a member or ever want to be and have no idea what is being posted in those forums. I joined there when it opened because I wanted to make sure VPMAX could be found at any FF forum and because Vertex had some great ideas for meshes which I wanted to be part of. Nothing negative has ever been said about FR there and there is nothing there cheering on IPS's actions either.

- CQ

[President Raygun]

So does anybody think he's reading this thread, because if he is 

Besides, Freedom Reborn is indestructible, and impervious to viruses, self-righteous jerks and everything short of nuclear fallout.

Truer words were never said

[Lionheart]

I'm a mod there... and I'm just learning about this now.

Don't make assumptions about who supports what actions.

HQ, you've been a mainstay here for a long time. You've helped me out a few times over the years, patiently answering questions and providing tips. Thanks for your contributions. I have no doubt that this is news to you as well.

I hope when things get going here again, you'll still be willing to post your original works. Quite a few of your older ones still find their way into my Rumble Room sessions.  

[BentonGrey]

I'm totally hurt, angry and thoroughly depressed (as are many of you, I'm sure)by what's happened...But truthfully, is there a point to these forums without the FF section?  Sports?  Y'all are killing me with the sports talk...Blech.  I visit the comics section and the movie/music/tv section from time to time, but I'm really here for the FF section...I'm here for FF, the FF community and the game's mod-ability.  

So I guess there will be no mods (or maps) from me based on Marvel characters/settings (or DC, etc...)...

Dana

Don't worry Dana, I for one am not going to let the content side of things fade away.  If the Admins decide not to bring that portion of the forums back (a decision which, at this point I would totally understand even as I would be deeply saddened by it), I would be willing to step up and provide a new board for those kinds of endeavors.  Also, there are other options, even if that doesn't become one.  I'm keeping track of email addys, and I will make sure everyone stays informed.  I'm still hopeful that the Admins will be able to sort all this out, though.

IPS is definitely watching.  He wants to feel like the center of attention...even if the attention is coming from a lynch mob.  He's lurking in the shadows here and on FU.  It's funny....or maybe sad...but he keeps claiming that he is no longer part of the community, and that he doesn't care, but he still hasn't left.  He's haunting the place, both literally and figuratively, and I know that he is still downloading content.