Buying new laptop

[Uncle Yuan]

I will soon be in the market for a new laptop.  I have no prolem with refurbished machines and have been looking at the Dell Outlet site.  But surely there must be other similar set ups for other companies.  Where can I go for a solid, inexpensive machine that I won't have to to worry too much about the quality?

My budget is $1000.00, max.  But if I can spend less than $800.00 I'd be very happy.  I would like something that can handle some moderate level gaming, but I don't think I would need a specifically "gaming" laptop.  For the most part this will be a work and general use computer.  Many laptops with Intel chips use "Intel Integrated Graphics Media Accelerator X3100" to handle graphics.  Is this any good, or should I look for a spcific video card?

Also, what should I look at for processors these days?  I haven't been following the technology, and I have no idea what's good anymore.  How does one compare the various dual core chips?  What's a good solid chip?  And what is on the way out?

[zuludelta]

Answering these questions will give me a better idea as to what to recommend:

- Will this new laptop be your primary computer, or will it be a supplement to your home computer?

- What applications/programs do currently use? What applications do you see yourself using/purchasing in the future (within the next 12 months)?

- Do you have a particular operating system preference? What is the predominant operating system in your school/workplace? Is there a clear preference for Windows, Macinstosh, or Linux? Do you work with/share proprietary file formats that are tied to particular operating systems or OS-specific applications? 

- Do you use your PC as a primary multimedia device (watching videos, listening to music, authoring media)?

- How often do you travel (or how often do you foresee yourself traveling) with your laptop? Will you be walking/commuting with the laptop often and across significant distances?

- Will you frequently use the laptop unplugged (i.e., using the battery), or are power outlets conveniently located in the places where you will most likely use the laptop?

- How savvy are you with making minor repairs/upgrades on your laptop? Are you comfortable with the notion of replacing the laptop's hard drive or adding more RAM by yourself?

- By your estimation, how long do you see yourself using a new laptop before buying a newer model?

[Uncle Yuan]

Answering these questions will give me a better idea as to what to recommend:

- Will this new laptop be your primary computer, or will it be a supplement to your home computer?

It will be my primary computer.  The current household computer will pass entirely into my wife's control.

- What applications/programs do currently use? What applications do you see yourself using/purchasing in the future (within the next 12 months)?

I will be using it for work - so an electronic patient record system that my residency will provide.  I will probably download Open Office or that other new open source office suite.  Otherwise I play games like City of Heroes, CivIV, FF - nothing too cutting edge, but decent video capabilities will be a must as I'm sure there will be at least a couple new games I'll want to pick up.

- Do you have a particular operating system preference? What is the predominant operating system in your school/workplace? Is there a clear preference for Windows, Macinstosh, or Linux? Do you work with/share proprietary file formats that are tied to particular operating systems or OS-specific applications? 

I have to be able to run Windows.  I'm fine with XP, ambivalent about Vista.  I have no particular objection to Apple, but all my games and work stuff is windows

- Do you use your PC as a primary multimedia device (watching videos, listening to music, authoring media)?

I may watch the occasional movie while traveling or on call.  I will use it to manage my iPod.  Some pictures, but I'm a pretty crappy picture taker.  I'd honestly like to do more of this stuff, but as of right now it's really not terribly important.

- How often do you travel (or how often do you foresee yourself traveling) with your laptop? Will you be walking/commuting with the laptop often and across significant distances?

It will go on the odd trip, but 90% of this computer's life will be at home, the clinic or the hospital, and plugged in.  There may be the rare trip to a coffee shop.

- Will you frequently use the laptop unplugged (i.e., using the battery), or are power outlets conveniently located in the places where you will most likely use the laptop?

It's a question of availability vs. desire.  Most of the places I use it will have outlets available, but I might get lazy, just go on o "do something quickly," etc.

- How savvy are you with making minor repairs/upgrades on your laptop? Are you comfortable with the notion of replacing the laptop's hard drive or adding more RAM by yourself?

I feel perfectly comfortable replacing modular components.  I've replaced hard drives, RAM etc before.

- By your estimation, how long do you see yourself using a new laptop before buying a newer model?

Hard to say for sure.  3-4 years at minimum.  But I really hate contributing so significantly to the waste stream.  And frankly I could go long indefinitely with minor upgrades if the state of the art didn't change so rapidly.  I don't necessarily buy just to keep up, but experience has shown that in about 3-4 years there will be enough changes in the tech to make keeping an old machine progressively more frustrating.  So something a little more cutting edge and with good upgradability would be attractive.

[zuludelta]

Okay, before giving specific recommendations, I'll try to answer your earlier questions to the best of my knowledge.

My budget is $1000.00, max.  But if I can spend less than $800.00 I'd be very happy.  I would like something that can handle some moderate level gaming, but I don't think I would need a specifically "gaming" laptop.  For the most part this will be a work and general use computer.  Many laptops with Intel chips use "Intel Integrated Graphics Media Accelerator X3100" to handle graphics.  Is this any good, or should I look for a spcific video card?

Integrated Graphics solutions should be perfectly serviceable for doing light to moderate gaming, although your definition of serviceable may vary... personally, my bare minimum definition of a playable frame rate is 30 fps.  Intel's X3100 Accelerator should be able to handle Freedom Force, FFvTR, and COX at low to moderate resolutions just fine. A game like Civilization 4 would be a bit harder for the x3100 to handle (unless something's changed with the latest driver updates). Last I heard, the Vista drivers for the x3100 have a lot of hiccups when it comes to handling shaders, although the XP drivers seem to be fine. You can get something like Civ 4 to run on the x3100 chipset at a playable framerate, but you'll definitely have to ratchet down the detail and graphics settings quite a bit. If you want to look into dedicated video chipsets, the minimum I would recommend are the laptop versions of NVIDIA 8400 and Radeon 2400 video chipsets. They're a step above Intel's x3100, don't cost extra on most "big name" laptops, and will play most current games reasonably well, although they will still struggle with the newest DirectX 10 games.

Also, what should I look at for processors these days?  I haven't been following the technology, and I have no idea what's good anymore.  How does one compare the various dual core chips?  What's a good solid chip?  And what is on the way out?

There's really not much to distinguish between AMD's Turion dual core processor and Intel's Core Duo processors these days. The Turion used to have a slight edge in processing power and the Core Duo had the slight edge in battery life, but those differences have been rendered moot in the past year or so. Since this is going to be your main computer, do not go for a Celeron M or any other underpowered processor best used for ultraportables.

Now for recommendations:

- Most of the "name" laptop makers (Dell, HP, Toshiba, Acer, Sony) make products that have a combination of a decent AMD Turion or Intel Duo Core processor and an NVIDIA 8400 or Radeon 2400 video chipset that sell in the ~$800 to $1000 range. It all comes down to your prior experiences with the companies or what you've heard regarding the reliability of their products. In my experience, customer support across most brands are pretty much the same (they're all equally dismal!), and product reliability is decent, if not exactly excellent (I've repaired/salvaged a lot of HPs and Dells, but that's due to the fact that they're the most popular brands, not necessarily because they are more prone to malfunction than other brands). If there are any reliable local professional PC builders in your area, you might want to ask if they make laptops with the required feature set in your price range. Many of those little shops provide free (and reliable) tech support with their products and patronage helps support your local cottage IT industry. 

- If you're really serious about getting an upgradeable laptop, you might want to look at the Asus C90 (marketed as the Asus C90S in North America). It's a "barebones" laptop that can be configured by the user... all the major components (Video card, CPU, screen, optical drives) are user-replaceable with third-party components, so you can upgrade and replace parts as your needs and budget change. It uses a desktop processor (which is more powerful relative to cost) but also generates more heat and use more power (a 2 hour battery life is probably optimistic) than your standard laptop proc. It uses NVIDIA's MXM ver.2 interface for the graphics card, so you can replace it if it becomes inadequate for future games (AFAIK, though, there are only a few options for user replaceable MXM video cards as of right now, and they're all pretty much above and beyond what you require). I've seen the barebones laptop (no CPU, no graphics card) selling for around $800 on eBay, and fully-configured ones selling in the $1000 price range.

[randyripoff]

My first question when I hear someone say that they're looking for a laptop is "Do you really need a laptop?"  Seriously, I know they are popular, but unless you travel a lot, you don't really need one.  You can find a good desktop fairly inexpensively, and an LCD monitor really isn't too expensive.

That being said, you may want to check out DiscountPC.  They specialize in off lease computers--specifically computers that were once leased by a corporation and have been refurbished.  If your processing needs aren't so intense, you might well be able to make something from there work for you.  Spend the money you save on memory upgrades, and you'll get a computer you can use for a while.

[Camma]

I recently bought a laptop for grad school.  While I generally fall under Randy's initial statement - not really needing (or wanting) a laptop - the MBA program required it.  Now I am perfectly fine building and maintaining a desktop but i have never attempted the same with a laptop so i am not as well versed in what you can customize.

I wanted to throw my 2-cents in just cuz i made this purchase recently and am quite happy with the outcome.  I spent $1100 (i know it a little outta your range) on an HP Pavillions 9000 series (im not at home or on it ATM so i forget the exact model #).  It has the wider 17 inch screen, the AMD dual core, the GForce Go graphic card, and my gawd more connection slots than i knew could exist.  It came with Vista, which was my first attempt and i kept it and so far its been ok to work with.  Zulu's assessment was pretty much dead on in terms of gaming.  Civ4 didnt work too well graphics-wise but then i got Beyond the Sword which has problems with Vista.  Playing CoX is touchy, and it tends to be a bit much for the mid range graphics card (im sure an upgrade there would help).

All in all, for what i need it for (ie school word processing, databasing, making presentations, and playing a few games and managing my ipod) i feel it was the best bang-for-the-buck out there.  I coulda paid a bit more for some higher end components, or saved a bit on the end, but this machine was a nice balance.

Oh and BTW, my mom is a doctor and having a laptop has really helped her out as she has to move between the hospital, office, and home, so im sure the laptop is going to be useful for your needs.

[Uncle Yuan]

Oh and BTW, my mom is a doctor and having a laptop has really helped her out as she has to move between the hospital, office, and home, so im sure the laptop is going to be useful for your needs.

Yeah - this is the issue.  I also prefer laptops on the whole, but with the new electronic patient records a laptop is pretty much becoming standard doctor issue.  I think I can get something from the Dell Outlet that will do pretty well.  And if I don't use up all my presents living until my next/first paycheck I may even be able to supplement my "tech allowance" a little.