Why do some people prefer FF to FFVTR?

manboy · July 07, 2008, 06:18:39 PM

I only stumbled across :ffvstr: while taking a look at city of heros online and once i got it i loved it. That was even before i discovered it could be modded and had such a large community. So i missed the whole :ff: thing and so have never played it.

Anyway ive noticed that a large amout of people still play :ff: and not :ffvstr: and was wondering if :ff: had some features or pros that are not present in :ffvstr: ?

Is it just due to the amount of meshes,maps and mods that are ff only?

Jakew · July 07, 2008, 06:46:39 PM

Yeah, plus some gaming mechanics, like energy, are different betweent the two games.

stumpy · July 07, 2008, 07:23:31 PM

I agree. There are lots of mods that are for the first game only and some of them are excellent. I would get FF just to play some of those mods.

In addition, some of the specific things not everyone was happy about included:

The energy system in the first game is a lot more flexible. Let's say you want to design a hero with a nice melee attack that he can use against a handful of thugs and not tire himself out too much, but against more thugs or against tougher baddies, he will eventually run low on energy. In FF, that's easy - give the power "minor" or "trace" energy cost and you are set. In FFvT3R, there is nothing you can do. Either the power would have to cost nothing and he can use it all day or it costs one third of his energy and it wears him down pretty quickly unless he has a really high energy stat, which may not fit his character concept. This was very useful for characters who shouldn't have superhuman energy regeneration.

(BTW, despite rumors that you may hear, there is no "new" zero-EP-cost attack in FFvT3R. FF had exactly the same zero-EP-cost attacks available.)

FF had two levels of overpowering and one level of underpowering. FFvT3R has one level of overpowering and no underpowering.

In FF you could command a squad character to repeat an attack as often he had enough energy to use it. That was a major convenience. In FFvT3R you can only repeat attack with zero EP cost.

In FF you could choose less than a full squad for a mission. Soloing some of the campaign missions was great fun. In FFvT3R we have to use an FFX workaround where you can design characters with the SEAT FILLER attribute to fill the other squad spots when you want to solo and then those characters will disappear right after the mission starts.

FF had more explicit CP and XP information. Not a big deal, but some people like to know.

For some reason, thrown objects don't do knockback in FFvT3R. In FF they did and it was realistic and pretty cool.

FF had no minimum range for projectile and beam attacks, whereas FFvT3R characters had to run away from a melee opponent before using their beam attacks or whatever. Fortunately, we figured out how to fix this, but it was a real annoyance in the base game.

FF squad characters don't start attacking baddies on their own. The AI in FFvT3R will cause squad characters to start attacking baddies when you haven't commanded them to. That can be very annoying when you want them to stand still or move elsewhere for some reason. We've gotten reduced this a bit, but it still crops up from time to time.

Anyway, I've gotten used to it and I enjoy the second game more, overall. But some of the changes were unfortunate and I still wish we had some straightforward way to remedy them.

Previsionary · July 07, 2008, 08:57:47 PM

Speaking of over and underpowering...did anyone happen to keep the scripts Ian worked out for over and underpowering? Did anyone save a copy of any of the scripts Ian made?

manboy · July 07, 2008, 09:55:25 PM

Thanks for the answers :thumbup: . I thought it was something to do with the game mecanics, some of those features (object knock back, overpower 2) sound like they should have been left in :ffvstr: . I might just pick up :ff: to try some of those mods out.

Its too bad this game wasnt commercially succsesful if it was im sure they would have added some of those features in some patches.

But the ff community is great and all mods and stuff have turned :ffvstr: into the most played game on my pc, i swear ive never taken the time to tweak and add so much stuff to a game before in my life! Great job guys :) !

thefallen · July 08, 2008, 06:56:11 AM

in my case :ff: was enough for me. the crossover potential could be greater than mugen, though i doubt a lot of those characters have, or ever will, appear in freedom force, but on the other hand, how else are you gonna play as someone like archangel or shadowcat?

steamteck · July 22, 2008, 03:50:46 PM

For me strangely one of the biggest bummers in the 2nd game is thrown objects cause no knockback. Really annoying to have the car BOUNCE OFF Batman. I play it because of all the other improvements ( mainly by the community actually)

Xenolith · July 23, 2008, 05:59:29 AM

I used to like the maps in FF better than the new ones in FFvTR, but not any more, thanks to Goggles. The lack of KB when struck by a thrown items really stinks.

style · July 24, 2008, 02:32:02 PM

More mod tools and too lazy to convert all my info to :ffvstr:

kaflinkle · July 29, 2008, 02:10:57 AM

For me the lack of knockback when struck by thrown objects was a deal breaker for me. I could've put up with the other stuff I didn't like but not that.

Great games though (although I've lost them now in a sort out and have to buy them again)

Boalt92 · July 29, 2008, 04:58:04 AM

Quote from: steamteck on July 22, 2008, 03:50:46 PM
For me strangely one of the biggest bummers in the 2nd game is thrown objects cause no knockback. Really annoying to have the car BOUNCE OFF Batman. I play it because of all the other improvements ( mainly by the community actually)

Well ... Batman did brace himself!

But seriously, a knockback fix is the one ffx add-on I'd love to see (I'm sure it would have been done if it were possible...).

Other than that I concur, the community add-ons for FFVTTR made the difference for me. I rarely, if ever, play FF1 anymore.

B92

kaflinkle · July 29, 2008, 05:09:49 AM

I'd love to see that fix, is it possible though? I would hazard a guess that it wouldn't be but what do I know

cmdrkoenig67 · August 06, 2008, 02:43:07 AM

I enjoyed the sheer variety of maps, objects and even special fx (wind-blown trash and leaves fx, even colored lighting effects) that you could add to maps.

Dana

qazwsx · September 18, 2008, 02:27:56 AM

Quote from: stumpy on July 07, 2008, 07:23:31 PM
I agree. There are lots of mods that are for the first game only and some of them are excellent. I would get FF just to play some of those mods.

In addition, some of the specific things not everyone was happy about included:

FF had no minimum range for projectile and beam attacks, whereas FFvT3R characters had to run away from a melee opponent before using their beam attacks or whatever. Fortunately, we figured out how to fix this, but it was a real annoyance in the base game.

How do you fix that?

stumpy · September 18, 2008, 10:13:58 AM

It is fixed in FFX, if you are running that.

You can also add a

Code Select

ff.RANGED_MIN = 1
line to ..\system\localinit.py anywhere below the import ff line.

danhagen · September 18, 2008, 10:40:07 AM

Some of us have no choice. There is no Mac version of the second game.

GogglesPizanno · September 18, 2008, 11:23:45 AM

QuoteSome of us have no choice. There is no Mac version of the second game.

I dont use Mac's so I'm just throwing this out there, but I got FFvTR running on Linux through Wine.
Empithee was talking about maybe giving Wine a shot on the Mac to see how it fared, so that may potentially be an option.

cmdrkoenig67 · September 19, 2008, 09:03:55 PM

Mmmmmmmmmmmm...Wine...Oh wait...You're talking about computers aren't you...

:oops:

:lol:

GogglesPizanno · September 19, 2008, 09:11:55 PM

Drink enough Wine and anything is possible...

Previsionary · September 19, 2008, 09:20:24 PM

Quote from: GogglesPizanno on September 19, 2008, 09:11:55 PM
Drink enough Wine and anything is possible...

Will drinking this "wine" allow me to destroy both Mercury and Mars with a snap of my fingers? Because, if it can't, I will be suing you. :P

GogglesPizanno · September 19, 2008, 09:41:06 PM

Yes its possible.
Just drink some more and keep clickin those heels.

In fairness its possible that if you caused the destruction of two planets, I might have to file a counter suit - mental anguish and all that. They would really get you on damages i think.

thanoson · October 07, 2008, 03:09:42 PM

For me, adding meshes and skins were a lot easier. I love knockback also. And I didn't want to convert all those files. Btw, dropped out of playing for a few years when I had to reformat my drive. Just moved recently and my internet is down for a couple of weeks. Found my FF disk and loaded up everything I have. Having a blast making my heroes and villains again. Running them through the danger room is still awesome. Thanks to you guys.