Freedom Reborn Archive

I thought that would get some attention!

Anyway, as old skool skinner who has skinned numerous owned characters and finally making my way to skinning original exclusively (with the occasional dip), I'd like to know how much interest is there in original characters?

For me honestly, there are very few original characters that I feel I need to download and give a twirl in Rumble Room, is this how others feel?

Yes, I love taking Thor into FF and having him fight Wonder Woman but I find more joy in creating something new with a history and fxs to enhance the gaming experience for someone else but if I'm doing all the work for naught, I'd like keep that in mind.

So honest feedback is required as I feel it helps.

EDIT: Not just talking about my originals but originals characters in general.

Your Hive world originals are the bomb! Wake me when the mod comes out! ^_^

I deal mostly in skinning originals as well. I have downloaded the majority of mainstream skins out there, but I don't use them in game very often unless I want to test one of my originals against them. I create for myself first and the community second.
I personally have all of your original skins downloaded as well as most of the originals that are released by others. There are a lot of great characters that are created within this forum. To me, that is what this game was made for.

Quote from: style on October 21, 2008, 12:04:32 PM
Your Hive world originals are the bomb! Wake me when the mod comes out! ^_^

Thanks but you and I both will be sleeping for a while on that one.

Quote from: billdamn22 on October 21, 2008, 12:27:59 PM
There are a lot of great characters that are created within this forum. To me, that is what this game was made for.

Yeah, I feel like that too.

QuoteI'd like to know how much interest is there in original characters?

In my case, an incalculable interest.
Mainstream Characters are fun, but limited in terms of storytelling and capacities.
A boundless game like  FFVTTR deserves more that kind of richer original characters.

As far as modding goes, it's very hard to get an original mod off the ground if you don't have the resources or the community interest which is why you see a lack of them. There's tons of mainstream content, but how many skinners are out there creating their own images or someone else's? Not many. It's the main reason I stay away from my SuL idea...that and I burned out and I doubt anyone would care about them as not many of you actually read the fiction when I had it posted. Two way street and all. ^_^

It certainly doesn't help that the original content that was shown off in the past barely got a passing glance while the mainstream stuff was gushed over for weeks at a time.

original characters expand the imagination and the adventure of the game.i love original characters.especially characters with the golden age feel.your hive characters have added a new dimension.not that i dont like beeing cap or spidey but the originals are just as fun.

Well I tell ya that I've jumped onto the originals bandwagon with my skopes as of late. Truth be told I think that I'll do originals "EXLCUSIVELY" or if I do a main stream character it'd have to be one that hasn't been done or an alternate costume. Even the "mainstream" characters that I'm working on right now have reimagined concepts and costumes...like my "Titans". And personally I think that anything that we create at this point SHOULD be for mods...original or otherwise...at least that's how I feel.

I really like the originals from a design standpoint. I think its really cool to see what skinners have come up with when not constrained to a predefined look or expectation. And i really like MODS that use original creations because again its all new in terms of powers and abilities and what not.

However in that middle ground between "Nice Looking Skin" and "Mod using original characters" is this grey area. I agree that while a short synopsis of character and they story especially in the context of a larger world is fun and interesting, my interest in extremely detailed backstory, fiction, etc... is limited, because that seems more personal to the creator of the character and is a lot to wade through for the casual person who may not have as detailed an interest. Also without hero files or some context to experience the characters in, they lose a lot of their impact and can get forgotten.

The fun of playing Freedom Force was that you got to experience these new characters through gameplay and their stories expanded gradually, so that it wasn't daunting to the player. I think an interesting way to do originals would be to include a hero file, but also maybe a simple "origin" EZScript mission (even just a basic "fight the badguys" mission), so people actually got to play the character. You could explain the character through cut scenes or dialogue which gives just enough history or info to be intriguing but not so much that its overkill.

With rare and spectacular exceptions, I download original meshes or meshes that can be used effectively with an Original Skin.
I usually only download skins that to me are 'best of breed' or Original. I'm not really interested in having 10 great Hulk skins, just one really really perfect one.

I realized a long time ago that this makes me a member of the minority.

Googles, I completely agree which is why Dr Mike has probably been the biggest influence on me as skinner and a creator for FF. He constructed a world and built these amazing people around it that I love. I just wish that level of inspiration was still at the forefront.

Quote from: Symon on October 21, 2008, 02:29:42 PM
With rare and spectacular exceptions, I download original meshes or meshes that can be used effectively with an Original Skin.
I usually only download skins that to me are 'best of breed' or Original. I'm not really interested in having 10 great Hulk skins, just one really really perfect one.

I realized a long time ago that this makes me a member of the minority.

You are not alone.

Goggles has it about right for me.  I too enjoy looking at original characters that the community has made, I envy thier creativity.  But as far as downloading them and playing them, thats just not for me (unless they are in a mod then its a different story).  I am only interested in playing mainstream established characters that I am familiar with to fulfill my childhood dreams of acting out battles with different characters and such.  Even though originals are plesent to look at I can't get into them as a character.

i have a load of characters sketch and designed, i just never really previewed them or uploaded them, honestly it's selfishness i've seen and received pm's about my av with people using him in ways i totally hadn't planned or agreed with. so i'd kinda hate to see what happens to my others

FFVTTR is getting so old... And still I can't see any rivals in terms of offered creativity.
You don't get that kind of feel when you make a skin or a model for a fps...
Where's the worthy successor? I miss the golden age.

Unfortunately the people posting in this thread are the die hard proponents of original characters, (myself included, its all I've ever made). It seems like its still the dozen or so of us beating the drum of original characters. We all know that originals are more rewarding and gratifying to make, and it seems that concept has gained some support in recent years, but I fear we will always be in the minority.
However being in the minority hasn't stopped us before, and I doubt it will stop us now.
I like the name of this thread though, I think I'll turn it into a new banner, I need to update my old one.

As for the fear of a character being misused or, even worse, misappropriated, I know a few skinners on this forum who share that view, that apprehension that their character could be stolen or twisted into something they aren't. Well I've been to devient art, and let me tell you, there are worse things to happen to your character than having them get trounced by the Avengers in the RR.
Share what you can make, even though it will get you very little recognition.
Most mainstream characters have been skinned and 'perfected'.
I won't ever need a new spidey villain skin after UE's contributions. I won't likely need another WW2 Ultimate cap after Renegade's mesh. I won't need another Hank Pym after Tommyboy's mesh.
I bet everyone here on this forum has made their own characters before. Let them live.
Now can be the time for the original characters.

Well just looking at my skinning record it's pretty obvious where I fall. I'm mainstream guy. That's where my greatest skinning interests lie and where my download interests lie. It's very very rare I download someone's original characters.

My greatest urge to skin comes from when I finish reading a comic with characters that I love. I read the latest A:TI and think "I need to skin the Crusader", thats my biggest motivator. In a way skinning is like fanart for me, or more so action figures.


I love seeing originals though, I always check out AA's Hive guys and DJ and Carr new stuff etc, but it's really just to see neat ideas and designs. I don't have much interest in actually downloading them and playing them.

However mods change this. I'm perfectly happy playing an original mod, best example is the Strangers. And that's where the issue is, the originals don't have much interest to me without that kind of context.

As for my own originals, I have tons on paper. I have a whole world with an extensive storyline. Some glimpses of them have been seen in the forum events and I actually did skin a few a couple years back but never previewed or released them. Back then the reason was that I was overly protective, now the reason is that they're old and comparatively suck. If I were to move on to originals I prefer to do it through a mod, which is something I'd really like to do, but honestly its unlikely do to time constraits and various interests.

I was wondering if there were skinners who would be willing to do commissions? I have a boatload of original characters that I'd love to have see the light of day, many whom a mod would be too much effort to bother with. Some I have a basic idea of their costumes, but others I don't and I'd love some help designing them.

Well, I imagine that everyone who has seen me post on these boards in the last year or so can imagine where I stand.  I'm fairly solidly in the mainstream side of things, although all of my mainstream efforts are devoted to my own original storylines and such.  There is an inherent investment in the characters that I already know and care about which is a hard thing for originals to overcome.  That being said, it is hardly impossible.  I always find myself moved by particularly brilliant concepts, or really spectacular skins and characters, especially those that I could see putting to my own uses.  Mods like The Strangers introduced me to original characters that I would STILL pay good money to read about monthly.  That lead to my own involvement in Liberty bay, a mod for which I dreamed up not a few characters, including my personal favorite, The Rogue.  So, in short, I am not uninterested in originals, but, just like with mainstream characters, not everything catches my eye.  Those that appeal most to me I make an effort to engage, like Car and DJ's Nazi team, which I can't wait to tangle with using the JSA!  I don't particularly appreciate the somewhat disparaging attitude some on the boards seem to have towards mainstream undertakings, however.  I feel like my work is no less original because I am using existing characters, as long as I am striving to create interesting stories and create something unique to me.  It is no less original to write an adventure for a favorite character than it was for the original Welsh poets who penned tales of Arthur and his knights.

For my own curiosity, since everyone keeps going to Strangers (and I have nothing against it, but I've yet to see anyone mention any other original mods yet [I'm ignoring that Aquaman lover]), how many of you went out and downloaded an original mod (outside of Mike's stuff) and gave it a try? Show of hands, did anyone try Lude's Guardian mod or my Heroes United (FR verse) and Heroes mod? How about wickerman's awesome Metal Storm mod or Herocity? Hrm, ok, how about Thug Stories or M25's mod (if you count the FF as originals since they aren't mainstream)? Erk...DOD mod by Lunar or even the Vampire mod by old time member, Capnwig? I just find this a bit interesting as most of those mods went largely unnoticed and they were 100% original, heh. There's not really a "lack" of original content, there was a "lack" of players/acknowledgment. This takes me back to my "two-way street" comment.

Well I haven't played a mod in years, but off the top of my head I have played the Strangers and Hero City (least I think it was Hero City). I want to say there was another original mod I've played but I don't recall. So yeah haven't actually played many, but I don't think I've played any mainstream mods made after the Strangers either, mostly for time and computer problems.

Quote from: BentonGrey on October 21, 2008, 10:16:42 PM
I don't particularly appreciate the somewhat disparaging attitude some on the boards seem to have towards mainstream undertakings, however.  I feel like my work is no less original because I am using existing characters, as long as I am striving to create interesting stories and create something unique to me.  It is no less original to write an adventure for a favorite character than it was for the original Welsh poets who penned tales of Arthur and his knights.

I think the subject of the topic that AA set out in the first post is original characters, not all original work for FF. A mod is an original work, even if it uses mainstream characters, and I'm sure would be as well received, if not more so (probably the latter) than one with all original characters. Certainly as far as I can tell mainstream mods are always better recieved than mods with all original characters.

And I think that there is the telling point. A modder pours his heart into a mod about his original characters for it to be overlooked/ignored in favour of a FF level swap featuring spider-man, galactus, hulk and wolverine as playable characters. That happened to me I'd be a bit down on mainstream stuff too. Thats the only time I have seen/felt a negative vibe towards mainstream endeavours, and thats in the instance of a mod, and limited to the few who have felt the 'mainstream burn'.

I can't say I've seen a negative attitude towards mainstream characters (skins/meshes) on this board. The mainstream meshes are what original makers draw their parts and tidbits from. I couldn't make any originals without the vast library of meshes and parts provided by our talented and generous meshers. And without skins to adorn them, well, they'd look like very nice soap carvings.

I admit I've been frustrated when I have seen a newbie skinner come onto the scene with an average looking mainstream skin, or one that does nothing new for the character or improve on what we already have access to, and is praised more than another skinner's original character released at the same time. I've seen it happen many times and I've seen it drive skinners away, talented individuals that could have helped the community grow. In those instances I've been frustrated by the mainstream bias, but thats like getting mad at Canadians for liking hockey or Australians for liking cricket. Its popular, its liked, its what the majority prefers, they are familiar with it, I can't blame people for getting excited about ANOTHER wolverine skin, but I sure can feel frustrated.
When i feel frustrated, i go make another skin, so everyone wins.  :lol:

Again this is just how I see it/what I have observed, I'm not saying anyone is wrong etc. etc.

When I started playing FF couple of years ago, I was only downloading mainstream characters.

But later on I got more interested in originals, which I mostly download nowadays. I also enjoy making hero files for them based on author`s description of the character.

As only a "lurker" for most of my time here, I must say that I think most people are here for the mainstream characters.  That being said, I have played several of the "original" mods (DOD, B. Brigade, Pulp Fiction, and Dr. Mike's mods et. al.). And I enjoy downloading the original characters and reading their backstories. I don't post many comments about them because I don't believe I can say much more than a "good job" to the creators. However, I do enjoy collecting them and playing the mods they are part of.
I guess as a "fanboy" for more years than I care to remember, any (and I mean ANY) comic characters for this wonderful game are appreciated whether mainstream or original. 
As a side note, I am constantly amazed and impressed at the creativity of the core members of this community. I know that it can only be the love of the game and the joy of your talents that allow you to maintain this interest.  I salute all of you. And I keep practicing in the hopes of regaining my lost talents of bygone years.  One day I hope to contribute more to this outstanding community.

<End of Rant>

I really haven't thought about it much....I guess I prefer mainstream and even the in-game characters, but I have played several  original character mods (Heroes United, Liberty Bay, Pulp Fiction, Guardians and few more) and I have enjoyed them.

As a rule, I haven't much interest in downloading original characters. skins, etc...I'm not sure why, though.

Dana

Clearly my creative drive is to make meshes, skins and mods of pre-existing characters, and for the most part, almost exclusively, that is what I download and play with by other people.
I've played pretty much every mod there has been, both 'original' and 'mainstream', and I can say that the reason the Strangers gets mentioned a lot is because it had huge technical and gameplay innovations, strong character design and characterization, and was well put together and constructed. Few mods, if any, can lay claim to all that. It was and is head and shoulders above what anyone else has achieved.
I do feel the distinction between mainstream and original is artificial. Everyday someone somewhere sees Superman or Spider-Man for the first time, and for them, they are 'new' and 'original'. To me a character doesn't have more or less merit because they were created five minutes or fifty years ago.
Arguing that it's somehow redundant to 'recreate' mainstream characters is like saying that it's pointless painting trees or landscapes or portraits, these have all been 'perfected', and 'done to death', so everyone must only strive to represent subject matter that has never been seen before, imaginary alien worlds. It is a flawed argument to me.
Firstly, I would strongly contest the notion that there is, was or ever will be a 'perfect' mesh skin or mod. Aside from the fact that this basically dismisses the efforts of every other artist, (and even other work by the artist who makes the 'perfect' one), it's wrong on other levels. Suppose you think my IM_MK21_tf mesh were the 'perfect' one of that character (I don't think that, I just use it as an example). Two days ago I discovered how to add bumpmapping to meshes, and adding that to the mesh improves it, so now it's better than the 'perfect' version it was three days ago. Technical innovations and personal artistic growth mean we never reach 'perfection'. Leaving aside subjective taste.
Secondly, if there can be 'perfect' renditions of characters, it sort of follows that there can be 'perfect' archetypes, that all 'dark knights' will be inferior to Batman, that all 'techno-warriors' will be pale imitations of Iron Man, that all 'storm gods' will derive from Thor. So if it's redundant to re-mesh/skin/mod existing characters, surely its equally redundant to re-create the ideas they represent in so-called 'new' 'original' characters. Since I disagree that meshing or skinning Batman again is pointless, I also disagree that creating a new Dark Avenger is pointless. Creative endeavour is creative endeavour, regardless of how 'original' it may be. The ten thousandth Wolverine Skin is equally worthy as a brand new character skin, one is not somehow 'worth' more than the other. It's worth creating new characters, but not a failure of some kind to enjoy the pre-existing ones, either.
Everything else is just personal preferences. I like all my mainstream meshes and skins and mods, but aspire to the technical expertise shown in the original skopes and skins those posting here make. I'll download and enjoy a Mod featuring new characters, just as I played through and enjoyed FF and FFv3R. And I'll enjoy mainstream Mods.

You are spot-on Tommy! :thumbup: I definitely agree with that.

I echo USAgent's comments. Although I'd like to add that the main reason I don't play with originals is because I can't skin myself. When I think of an original, I like to be able to design the costume as well as their powers. Instead, I have to rely on other people's ideas when it comes to the costume, so it's not a true original for me.
What I'd really love to see is more development of the FF Machine tool that BeardedInLair started. It allows you to select pieces of skins to put on a mesh. So you can basically create your own costume. I'd love to see original skin pieces made for this tool to increase variability and even enhance the tool itself to work with any mesh.

Here's a link to the tool:
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/ffmachine

I like both. I download and play mainstream characters more often, due to the childhood nostalgia factor, but I love looking at clever and well-done originals. It helps if they include a hero file, so I can just drop them in the Rumble Room and watch 'em go. And if they're in a mod, so much the better.

As a skinner, I've done a handful of originals. It's a lot more work starting from scratch, obviously, and it can be hard to judge how "successful" they are, since you don't have an existing template to compare it to. But it's a good challenge, and I recommend all skinners try it at least once.

QuoteI admit I've been frustrated when I have seen a newbie skinner come onto the scene with an average looking mainstream skin, or one that does nothing new for the character or improve on what we already have access to, and is praised more than another skinner's original character released at the same time.

That's a classic^^ During my works on Bid for Power. I made a Kanci from FLCL. Huge work... accessoires, unique animations, and he was able to transform in a Cannon! In real time! Guess what? He went unnoticed because shortly after was released a 10th Broly or a 27th Gogeta^^

Ok ok^^ that's just an exemple.Almost a troll, since Bid for power was based on Dragon ball, so the public was quite young and well... monomaniac^^

I just mean that mainstream characters will always get more success that original ones. Because they are preceded by their fame, they gigantic background and the passion they provoke.
I do not mean that doing mainstream characters, liking them or playing with them is pointless! Hell no.
That's natural to accomplish some work on a subject that inflame us. (Out of FFVTTR I kept trying to make a game based on one of my favorite cartoons for years).
It's not a matter of merit or talent.

It's risky for Modders/Writers  to make something original. They are freed from the narrative and gameplay constraints of the mainstream characters but they need enough assets to do all what they dream off and they'll have to fight a little more to make their mod accepted since it does not seduce the players at first sight as the mainstream does.
But I loved the strangers, and Liberty Bay enthused me so much that I joined them. As reformed enthused me later.
Once those characters got a behaviour, powers and adventures, they exist as strongly as spidey. ( a voice helps a lot ^^)

That's why original skinners should work in unison with with modders. Like our sex machine told before so innocently (You don't fool me magnificent bast'rd ^^)

Anyway, the main goal is to have fun.

Quote from: Volsung on October 22, 2008, 08:25:07 AM
I just mean that mainstream characters will always get more success that original ones. Because they are preceded by their fame, they gigantic background and the passion they provoke.

Absolutely. I totally agree. Originals, no matter how much thought and work and background info that could go into it, will usually be overshadowed by Mainstream.

I mean, take any player new, really, really new to FF. Sit him/her down and say, "OK, choose between playing as Batman or"... I dunno, for example's sake, "Afghan Ant." 90% of the time, they'll pick Batman, simply because he's better know.

Having said that, I personally play with originals. Granted, they're usually my own originals, but I have been known to download and play as others originals. In fact, now that I think about it, the only mainstream I personally use are obscure ones.

^^^agrees with volsung.

The reason I find this discussion interesting now--outside of skins, skopes, fxs, and hexes, which there's barely a lack of--is that just last year there were at least 4 different modders with original mods being shown off and asking for help or feedback and all those mods went unnoticed even by some of the posters here. So, I'm trying to figure out why it's on a sudden upswing now and not back then, heh. Going by a recent example, Voltimax asked for help quite a few times or even a word of encouragement. I know for sure that I and Carra helped him, but that thread went mostly unnoticed by the public which is one of the contributing factors to that mod being shutdown. It was an origin mod based on his avatar in the NPI-verse iirc. So, if the community suddenly wants more original content mods, then we're going to have to get better at cultivating the plants. The very least you could do is encourage someone to stick with an idea whether you actually play it or not.

In other fields of interest, I always find a mainstream skin creative and original because no two skins by any person "should" look exactly alike. You may not go out and download them all because you've already found the perfect one, but just like these characters are drawn differently by every artist that touches them, you get a pick of variety every time someone touches the character. I do wish people would go out and skin different versions of some characters to move away from their current/classic looks, but that doesn't always happen. It'd be even better if new costumes were designed for mainstream characters all the way around really (Hi murs! --Exiles reference).

And...yeah, I think that's about it. No, I'm not just saying that because I forgot whatever else I was going to say. Who told you that?! *panics*

...

*disappears*

i like them both equally well.when i get bored with mainstream i go original and vice-versa.like the man said earlier...its all about having fun.i wish i could do what you guys do.your all AWSOME in my book.

Quote from: Carravaggio on October 21, 2008, 04:31:08 PM
As for the fear of a character being misused or, even worse, misappropriated, I know a few skinners on this forum who share that view, that apprehension that their character could be stolen or twisted into something they aren't. Well I've been to devient art, and let me tell you, there are worse things to happen to your character than having them get trounced by the Avengers in the RR.

i know what you mean by dev art lol, i have no problem with people using flesheater in the rumble room, you can have anyone knock the crap outta him all you want, it was aspects like people changing his origins, pm'ing me with changes to his colour scheme,asking can they use him as another character etc that turned me off releasing my originals. i have no problem showing them here just letting you lot get a hold of them :P

Ok here's my guilty secret: I've never put mainstream characters into my FF game. I really don't like it, all I'm interested in is my own original universe, that of FF and other peoples original stuff like AA. It's so much more dynamic and off the wall, which makes it more fun to play

Certainly mods and skins of originals get less interest, but I'm always watching DJs or Cars threads as mostly their work in new and refreshing, opposed to a variation on something you've seem before.

I'm all about the mainstream characters.

I've downloaded some original skins/meshes and made them into my 'own' characters, like generic villains. I'm sure we all have a whole universe of superhero and supervillain characters created in our minds from our youth.. and maybe one day I'll create mine for FF... but I'd create them for myself, not expecting others to get into them. I'd understand that, though. I'm the only one 'invested' in them and that's why I'll be doing mainstream characters for as long as I can, because I understand that people what these characters..especially since there are still so many that have never been done before. I got into this game because it was the coolest way to make The X-men fight the Sinister Six.. or the Avengers against the Marauders..  or the Teen Titans against the New Warriors...battles that once could only be left in the realm of imagination are fully realized before my very eyes. My inner geek is full of glee.

Im the opposite, i only download originals tbh. I never found it fun skinning mainstream because it was already done so many times, when i see originals in threads it immidiately catches my attention and i can sit staring at the skin and bio for quite some time. I first bought this game to see some new heroes fight new villains and when i found out it was possible to actually skin and make your own heroes i was dazzled, i made insanely powerful heroes fight insanely powerful villains and let my imagination try to develop relations between the opponents. I already knew that Xavier tries to change Magneto's point of view and that they always end up sending the Acolytes against the X-men and the X-men coming out on top.


Im all about redesigns of mainstream though :D

Quote from: the_ultimate_evil on October 22, 2008, 09:32:11 AMi have no problem showing them here just letting you lot get a hold of them :P

Which is a shame for people like me; your skins are fantastic. But I'm one of those players who doesn't necessarily follow the artist's story ideas, but makes new characters out of them (to a certain extent) for danger room use. However, if I use custom skins for my own purposes, it is always for personal use, not to share/change for public consumption.

I like both mainstream and custom, but actually prefer original character skins. If people download my skins and use them for characters other than what they were created for, that's fine with me -- as long as its for personal use only. If anyone wants to use my characters in a mod, I'm open to discussion.

Unfortunately, I haven't had much time for skinning of late (which is bad; I owe YL a couple of skins).

But to all the skinners of original characters: I enjoy your work and download many, many of them, and anticipate many more (like Car's internationals, etc.; subtle hint  :) ).

I've been 100% original from day one... oh so many years ago.  Stuck to it no matter how little recognition original chars got vs mainstream because my philosophy was to skin for my own enjoyment... and if anyone wanted to join the ride... they were welcome to do so.  I don't think it would be in-appropriate to suggest that I personally  influenced many skinners to do original work through the years indirectly by my own dedicated example or through direct encouragement and guidance even. 

I will admit that the biggest nods of encouragement has come to me over the years when other skinners and artist sought to do renditions of what I created.  One particular character of mine has been rendered in several drawings, a couple of paintings and has been skinned by C6.  Yeah when arguably the #1 skinner of all things mainstream asked to skin one of my originals... I couldn't help but have a sense of pride in that I was actually reaching a few peeps with my ideas.

Regardless of how we think our original creations are received... we should never stop doing them if you get a personal satisfaction out of seeing something from your own mind manifested.  4 out of 5 may prefer mainstream... but don't deprive that one from sharing in your creativity.  I love the amount of original work I've seen done in recent times.  And I hope it continues in one fashion or another.

I personally collect original skins only.  I love the stories.  I only have mainstream skins because they come with the meshes.

QuoteAs for the fear of a character being misused or, even worse, misappropriated, I know a few skinners on this forum who share that view, that apprehension that their character could be stolen or twisted into something they aren't.

That's pretty much the reason I've stayed away from originals. I think Canadian Shield and my C-6 avatar are my only original releases (other than the community avatar redesigns and skinning challenges I use to do). I have skinned original characters...but I doubt that I'll ever show or release them. Come to think of it...one of my very first few skins....many years ago now...was one of my originals!

Quote from: House Quake on October 24, 2008, 06:31:55 PMOne particular character of mine has been rendered in several drawings, a couple of paintings and has been skinned by C6.  Yeah when arguably the #1 skinner of all things mainstream asked to skin one of my originals... I couldn't help but have a sense of pride in that I was actually reaching a few peeps with my ideas.

Fyrehawk is cool man! So cool I actually made 3 skins for him...golden, silver, and modern age! :cool:

When I was doing FF skins I focused exclusively on original characters; mostly my own and a few requests here and there.  I loved the feeling of "What'll it look like when I try ______?" and birthing a concept.  That wouldn't have happened with mainstream characters.

My interest is completely on Originals now. I have very little exitement left for mainstream.

I love the originals Carravagio, AA, DJ, Tomato and Unkoman makes.


As for why little interest in original mods are shown apart for strangers. Very easy, People always love playing their favourite characters. And originals has to earn their interest. Very few people can compete with what Dr Mike was able to do, and sadly that is what is required to get your originals mod any notice.

But luckily the community are MUCH more originals pro than it used to be in the beginning. It was almost impossible to get help on originals back then. So there is light... :P

And I will be adding my contribution to this soon. and yes soon is a very loose term  :banghead: :P

Due to my lack of experince with computer generated art/art on the internet, I don't completely understand the thought/concept that "my ideas could be stolen."  On the surface, it makes sense, but really, who steals this kind of stuff and what would they do with it?  It's not going to end up in another game.  It's not going to be made into a comic book by Marvel or DC, or really anybody else for that matter.  Sure, somebody could take your file, post it on another website and say, "look what I did," but I don't see this as being very important, in the big picture.  I'd say your best option to protect your original stories/concepts is to put them on a a webiste dedicated to your original universe and share them with the public.  That's the best protection...public record. 

As a side note, look for my original '60s style on-line comic strip in 2009.  :)  Seriously.

Oh, I like mainstream meshes and skins.

Quote from: Previsionary on October 22, 2008, 09:07:07 AM

In other fields of interest, I always find a mainstream skin creative and original because no two skins by any person "should" look exactly alike. You may not go out and download them all because you've already found the perfect one, but just like these characters are drawn differently by every artist that touches them, you get a pick of variety every time someone touches the character. I do wish people would go out and skin different versions of some characters to move away from their current/classic looks, but that doesn't always happen. It'd be even better if new costumes were designed for mainstream characters all the way around really (Hi murs! --Exiles reference).

Hi Prev! :D

I just caught this topic late, and it's a good one.

I could never do my own original characters. Wouldn't know where to start. In all the years I've been skinning and playing this game(off and on) I haven't even come up with my own avatar! :o
Like Prev mentioned above, I've been strongly considering doing personal variations of mainstream characters and also some "what if..." skins as well. Such as "What if Wade Wilson received the power ring instead of Hal Jordan?" Things like that. Not sure when I'll start skinning again, but when/if I do, that's what I'll be doing. That's about as original as I'll ever be. I know, I suck.

I like originals, especially more when they come with a .hero file and back story to them. If they lack those two components I usually just stare at them in CTOOL and marvel at their beauty. That's it though. But, if they come with a backstory and .hero file, I'll actually play them. I guess I feel more connected to the original if it has some background to it. I feel the more depth provided, the more interest will be generated. Having something that's aesthetically pleasing is great and all, but providing more depth to your originals through story(or even just a quick summary) will help establish a connection with other members. Think of it as fishing. The skin is your bait, and the hook is the depth/story of the character. You can lure the fish with the bait, but you can't catch it without the hook.
That said, I should probably comment more then just downloading and enjoying originals to encourage progression and growth.

p.s. If anyone skins Deadpool as a Green Lantern I'll kill them.

Back when I actually played the games, and mods... I would play everything. Originals, mainstream (of which there were many more), whatever. But that was a while ago. My computer has trouble running FFvsTR so I didn't play that many mods for it. Really it's all about the artistic opportunities for me now.

So which skins do I download? To be honest... I don't really. I download meshes so that I can have a large stock in case I ever want to skin on some of them. I may download some skins to glance at closer. See them laid out, and just check them out, but I usually won't keep them. And I've almost never used somebody else's hero files except for when I needed to for a specific purpose. I still have the occasional rumble room run, in which I use mostly original characters of my own. It's purely a selfish thing, I guess.

And then we come to my own skinning. I skin originals. I have skinned mainstream, but that's mostly by the wayside now. Even when I did I tended to focus on lesser known characters. Why? I know that there will be a better skinner than me out there making those mainstream guys. And I'm glad for it. If there wasn't a C6 or somebody is it possible I would be trying to skin mainstream guys? Maybe. I think the game would certainly be a lot less interesting to me if I hadn't stumbled upon the enormous wealth of mainstream skins that I did, and got to watch it grow. I definately like to see them.

Basically what I am saying in my round about way (as I'm apt to do) is that I love all content. I don't use all content but I love to see it or listen to it or even just to know that somebody was excited enough to make it. FX, sounds, skins, meshs, mods. Original or mainstream or underground or fringe. I'm the guy who skinned John Doe the Generic Man (who I should get around to updating one of these days)! I friggin' love it all!

Quote from: Courtnall6 on October 25, 2008, 07:44:56 AMThat's pretty much the reason I've stayed away from originals. I think Canadian Shield and my C-6 avatar are my only original releases (other than the community avatar redesigns and skinning challenges I use to do). I have skinned original characters...but I doubt that I'll ever show or release them. Come to think of it...one of my very first few skins....many years ago now...was one of my originals!

Hey don't forget Vincent London! We both can take credit for him! :thumbup:

I think the only two orignal characters I've released are my avatar and his evil twin Boogeyman. I've done original skins, but haven't released any of them. Most are related to the Champions game I run, and not all of them are my characters. I try not to do skins that have already been done because, well, they have already been done. I've always had an interest in obscure, forgotten, or off the wall characters (The Glob is an homage to Plastic Man), so I generally release those. I have a lot of mainstream stuff (and quite a few kitbashes) that I'll never release, just because someone else has done another, probably better, version.

Yeah, be original.

I know I'm necroposting almost, Ive been away from these boards, but I had to talk about this.
Ask yourself this...

What if Irrational Games had sought out licensing from Marvel, and Freedom Force had actually been a 60's Avengers game? Would it have made the game better?
It might have sold better, who knows, but consider your own experience in playing FF the first time. Compare it with playing Marvel Ultimate Alliance perhaps. I'm assuming if you're still here you have some passing knowledge of comics and superheroes in general.

Seeing spider-man in a game gives you a grade A fan-gasm. You go "Hey its Spidey!", perhaps get a warm glow as you remember reading comics, watching cartoons or TV shows about him, maybe playing in the park as a kid with a red and blue coat on. And thats about it. After that you may well start to focus on inconsistencies, like how he doesnt swing properly, or you cant pull buildings down like he did on Venom that time...

Compare with seeing The Ant. This gives you a grade B fan-gasm, a superior experience in my mind. He's a nerd, hes never had a girlfriend, he has undignified insect powers, in this case that make him scuttle through the earth like a worm.. Part of your brain goes: "Hey! Its Spidey! Only different..." Only this time you've had to work for it, using the parts of your brain that solve crossword puzzles and such.

And the Ant's a pretty basic one. More sideways less obvious characters like Law and Order set off images of Thor, Valkyrie, Cloak And Dagger, Daredevil, Starhawk all at once. And this to me is way more satisfying.

In comics its the same.
Im a huge fan of Alan Moore's 1963, of the Squadron Supreme, Mark Millar's "Americans" run in the Authority for this very reason.
One of my favourite throwaway characters appeared in "Here Comes Tomorrow" arc of Morrison's X-Men: Smith the Maker. A sort of amalgam of Thor and Forge who spoke in thee's and thou's and carried a hammer. He lived for about 3 panels maybe, but he's still in my head right now.

Go make stuff like that.

Well. For me, what made me really get this game was the idea of creating my very own characters. That's what was said in the box. So that was what i had in mind. I didn't even imagine making marvel or dc characters was possible for this game. Not until i surfed the internet and saw all these "goodies" were available for download. I downloaded even original character skins to add some variety in the generic heroes that were available in the game. (Yeah, since i didn't know how to begin skinning at that time, it was an easy way or lazy way of creating more original characters for me. :blush: Hehe.)

I have some original characters i really want to skin. But i have been putting them aside. Still need some work on the stories, costume design and their actual powers. I can't make up my mind sometimes. :P Hopefully, i'll be able to actually make a good skin for them.  :rolleyes:

   I don't know that a 60's Avengers game would have been better than FF. I also agree that reimagined and redefined mainstream characters bring a refreshing feeling to not only this game, but to comics in general.
   I have tried to collect original characters when I can, and agree that hero files and backstories are an added bonus, making these characters more playable. I have tried to create my own characters, and I have also tried to reimagine mainstream characters, and have failed miserably at both.
   I hope the community as a whole appreciates the amount of hard work, creativity, and love that goes into developing one's own characters. It's really difficult, and personally, I really appreciate those who preview and share their own stuff.
   That's all for my monthly check - in. Till next time.
   

I mostly play with mainstream characters and mix in some originals when I want to add some variety. Considering the freedom that this game + FFX gives it's only logical we'd want to play out many of the scenarios we've actually read in comic books for years,  and  inspite many skinners and modellers being aware of that and satisfying that demand this thread for some reason seems to take a mostly negative view on that. I believe Freedom Force is the best game for mixing heroes and IMO it's extensive modding capablitites (+the skilled artists in this community) means that it gives the most authentic recreation of these heroes. There's little wrong with satisfying that need.