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Author Topic: understanding bump maps  (Read 978 times)

Offline seraglio

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understanding bump maps
« on: July 20, 2019, 05:47:49 AM »
I followed Tommyboys tutorial in adding a bump map to a mesh im working on. I was nonplussed with the results. My goal was to add more "depth" and "shadow" to the darker parts of the image. The result looks like a reflection map, even after altering luma all the way down to .1. His tutorial references having to have a reflection map. Basically what does a bump map actually do? Whats a good reason to use one. How does the reflection map play into the overall efffect? I like How Tommyboys captain america and especially his Thing_tf meshes look. Interestingly neither one have a bump map enabled if you look in nifskope and neither uses a separate "male_basic_bump.tga like he tells you to make in the tutorial, so I'm just confused(or looking in the wrong place). Someone splain me please.

Offline daglob

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Re: understanding bump maps
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2019, 03:12:28 PM »
Have you got something that will generate a bumpmap? The Nvidia plug-in that lets you save Photoshop files as .dds will save a map that can be used as a bumpmap.

Offline SickAlice

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Re: understanding bump maps
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2019, 04:25:18 PM »
I cheat and honestly it's pretty easy if you already understand how to add a texture effect (NiMaterialProperty) in Nifskope. So you add a texture effect, same as you would add a reflective or glow to one that was missing it. In the same drop down menu there's all sorts of other texture type selections, bump maps are one. So you enable that like you would the others. That's it. I dump the reflection side of things personally, 0. It never did anything but make them look like they had been spraypainted with metal primer.

For the bumps just get a free program that makes bumps, lots around the web to chose from. I have Crazybump which is paysoft but got school to pay for it then. Anyways those programs just build them for you and properly. A bump map since you asked creates the illusion of depth, more so small depth like on our own bodies for example. The ruffles on your shirt, the layers of your hair. It adds a more refined look in game instead of what looks like a textured 3d model. The other thing the engine uses for this heavily I might add is the stencil mask. This is used to create the same illusion as well pull off small detail like hair and fur without killing the game engine with the load. Most of the meshes for the second have this feature, the chicken is the easiest example to see by looking at it's texture and the alpha map for it's feathers. Then of course the rest of the material properties work in any similar way to doll it up in game basically.

Nvmd, I recall it crashing in game for some reason but maybe that was a different NiProperty. *shrug*
« Last Edit: July 21, 2019, 12:52:21 AM by SickAlice »

Offline seraglio

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Re: understanding bump maps
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2019, 07:07:40 PM »
ok ton of help here guys thanks. So what I'm getting here is:

there is something called a "bump map" that must be "generated" I thought the "bump map" was just a copy of the main skin, like a glow or reflection. It sounds like its more like a lightmap, like reflections use. Is this correct. I don't have an example to look at.

The tutorial I read on tommyboys site :

http://www.tommyboymeshes.freedomforceforever.com/BumpmapTutorial.html

quite specifically talks about FF1. His meshes are for FF1. He discusses how you would change Luma for FFVTR differently than FF. This seems to contradict bump maps not working at all in FF. Help me square the difference.

On tommyboys site right now, his thing_tf mesh. The "scales" have great depth and shadow, they look great in FF Cviewer. Is this just a good skin, or bumpmapping?

Offline daglob

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Re: understanding bump maps
« Reply #4 on: July 20, 2019, 08:02:03 PM »
Tommy has a Thing, Captain America, and Iron Man on his site that use bump maps.

Offline Cyber Burn

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Re: understanding bump maps
« Reply #5 on: July 21, 2019, 12:22:48 AM »
Here's Tommy's "Fan_4_The_Thing_Bumpy_TF" Mesh in NifSkope. There's definitely a spot for a "male_basic_bump.tga" already included in the Mesh itself. As for the  :ff::ffvstr: issue, there has always been a problem with FF1 Meshes being too dark when placed straight into FFvt3R (If I remember correctly), which is why EZ NifConvert has a little box to check to brighten the light values of Meshes being converted.



Offline Cyber Burn

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Re: understanding bump maps
« Reply #6 on: July 21, 2019, 12:29:37 AM »
Sorry for the double post, but here is where the Bumped Meshes are located, towards the bottom of the page:

http://www.tommyboymeshes.freedomforceforever.com/Marvel%20meshes%20B2.html

Offline SickAlice

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Re: understanding bump maps
« Reply #7 on: July 21, 2019, 12:57:29 AM »
Eh, I dunno friend. I think T was just getting into them as was I at the time and kind of thought that was the way it's done but it really isn't. Look at the bump maps I included in any of the stuff I released, usually with conversions. Or at any tutorial online about how to make bump maps. They aren't really done that way at all, just saying and that's probably why when he followed that tutorial they didn't come out looking right to him. Granted again there wasn't a lot of know-how back then but they became an industry standard since. Actually his technique is closer to how a displacement map is generated.

Here long story short: In Nifskope click on the meshes NiTexturingProperty and add another source texture. Name it to whatever your bump map will be and save the nif. Make the actual texture with the same name referring to tutorials on how to make a bump map for video games. Done. Here is an already done one that you can just copy the bump map properties from if you wish that also gives you an idea what the texture should look like against the standard texture of the model.

http://catman.freedomforceforever.com/uploaded6/MB_Bump.rar



« Last Edit: July 21, 2019, 01:48:42 AM by SickAlice »

Offline seraglio

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Re: understanding bump maps
« Reply #8 on: July 21, 2019, 03:24:44 AM »
I think I understand now. Thanks all so much for your patience.